[Emmdenn]

Also wanted to add — my sisters poodle is way friendlier, smarter, sweeter and has a MUCH nicer coat than the doodles. She’s such a great puppy I’d get a standard poodle in a heartbeat if I wanted a non-shedding dog.

 

[Hildae]

Another thing about them I find so gross is that all that beard around their mouths gets so filthy and stinky and drips water and saliva all over the place. And it’s always wet and damp. Or full of food smells or dirt. Always. Nothing like a soggy, stinky, dirty beard trying to lick you in the face.

That one gets me too. I don't care for bearded breeds.

 

[Megora]

I wanted to make sure I came back to this thread as I own/co-own 4 goldens and most of my family members have doodles, my sister just got a well bred standard poodle puppy also.

Every time we are together (my family has a lake house where all 9 family dogs visit) everyone comments on how clean and nice my dogs coats are (usually they actually have not been freshly bathed — they just have nice correct coats). My dogs are in and out of the water, they dry nicely and that’s it. I do my own grooming, which means my grooming costs are just for my own supplies.

The doodles on the other hand— have horrible coats. The get groomed every 6 weeks and it’s at least $200 in our area. Something I didn’t realize about doodle coats are because of the curly mixture of the coat types (golden or lab and poodle) they mat like CRAZY every time they get wet. The ones in my family are constantly getting shave downs because even with brushing they mat SO easily. Another thing about them I find so gross is that all that beard around their mouths gets so filthy and stinky and drips water and saliva all over the place. And it’s always wet and damp. Or full of food smells or dirt. Always. Nothing like a soggy, stinky, dirty beard trying to lick you in the face.

The fluffy, teddy bear paw feet always need to be shaved because they get wet and dirty and yeasty, which the dogs then lick, creating hot spots and fungal growth. So they’ve mostly taken to shaving the feet and face…which means basically they look like standard poodles…

All of the doodles in family— completely unrelated have food allergies and anal gland issues.

So while you may think you’re getting the best of both breeds with a low shedding coat — you’re not. You’re getting a random mix of the breeds which a coat that is NOT easy to maintain and requires constantly brushing, shaving, bathing, expensive grooming appointments and will likely come with allergies and other issues.

A well bred golden with consistent grooming, kept clean and with occasional brushing is WAY easier to maintain. I vacuum once a day and I don’t have hair all over my house. My dogs don’t smell and neither does my house!

I used to work for somebody who owned a lab/poodle mix. Dogs fur was clipped/shaved but felt grimey from collection of oils and dander. He also smelled bad.

 

[Laurelin Goldens]

My aunt has a couple of rehomed doodles and my gosh do they stink. They are black, so you can't see the red fur from the yeast, but you can definitely smell it.

 

[ceegee]

(...) I love goldens. I think they are the most beautiful dogs with the best kid-friendly temperament for my 7 yo daughter. However, I also love having a clean house. I do not exercise every day. I have a large back yard with a creek behind it and a medium sized fenced in area that is currently overgrown, but could be re-worked to be a play area. I'm in constant inner conflict. I am leaning towards a golden and hoping that bathing once a week, doing the forceful blowing thing, and buying all the brushes will help offset the shedding.

If you love having a clean house, you might want to consider some other aspects of dog ownership, in addition to shedding. For example, when it rains, your dog is going to come into the house with wet feet and will track mud through your house. It will roll in dead leaves, then come in and shake them off all over your floor. It will swim in the creek, then come and shake water droplets all over your kitchen cabinets. It will occasionally eat stuff that will make it throw up on your nice clean floor. When its anal glands become itchy, it will scoot its butt on your best carpet. If you live in an area where there are ticks, it will bring them into your home on its coat. Not least, puppies are like human infants, in that they have no control over the muscles that regulate elimination. So, regardless of what you do, your new puppy is going to pee and poop in your house for at least two months, until it develops enough control to wait until you take it outside. Most dogs are not reliably clean in the house until they are five to six months old, so you will be cleaning puddles of urine (and worse) for a certain period of time.

(...) Could you give me your feedback on a particular doodle breeder? I'm just curious after reading so many posts about crosses on here. A doodle breeder I researched and am considering, Moss Creek Goldendoodles, has beautiful golden parents on their website with all the major health clearances. They report that a lot of their dogs go on to be therapy dogs and their Owner's FB Group members validate this claim. They seem to produce at least some calm, even tempered dogs according to the owners (There are 5000 members in the FB group). I know that the ppl on this forum say that no reputable golden breeder would ever sell their dog to a doodle breeder. So I'm curious if this is true, how they would have obtained their golden retrievers? (None of the moms that they actually proposed to me were on their website and I did not see their health clearances. However, the owner said that it was because they had not had a chance to add these moms to the website yet.) The puppies are $3500.

Short answer: this website made me want to cry.

Long answer: I own a purebred golden retriever and a purebred toy poodle and I can't for the life of me imagine why any sane person would ever want to combine these two breeds. My golden is an amazing dog. He's funny and intelligent and energetic and enthusiastic about whatever I want him to do. He's highly trainable, incredibly eager to please, extremely focused, has a nice wash-and-wear coat and loves every living creature. Sure, he can be messy in the house, but he's a sweetheart and my constant companion and I wouldn't trade him for the world. My toy poodle is also an amazing dog. He's smarter than any non-human I've ever met. He's calculating and manipulating. He can be snappy. He can't be trusted alone anywhere in the house, because he will steal whatever is there, even if it's in a tin box. He has to be with a human or in a crate; there is no middle ground with him. He's also highly trainable, once he has understood what's in it for him. He was my daughter's agility partner and they won literally everything there is to win in the sport, including several national championships. He doesn't shed, but requires six-weekly trips to the groomer ($50 each time) to keep his coat nicely trimmed, as well as daily brushing and frequent baths (otherwise he smells). When it suits him, he's a cuddly lapdog. He's hardly a sweetheart but he's such an amazing character and I love him dearly.

If you mix these two breeds, it doesn't mean you'll end up with a smaller dog that has the golden retriever personality and a non-shedding coat. That's not how it works.

My daughter was a dog training instructor for several years until she left to go to university, and some of her worst students were doodles. Incapable of focusing, poor temperaments, uncontrolled energy, etc. And most of them cost double what I paid for my lovely golden retriever.

Now, to the website you mentioned. Why did it make me want to cry? For a start: English goldendoodles? Have we really sunk that low? Are people really dumb enough to believe that doodles descended from "English cream" golden retrievers (imported from Romania in this case) are somehow superior to doodles descended from other goldens? And to pay $3,500 or more for them? Next: There is absolutely no way for prospective buyers to check any of the claims made about the health of the breeding dogs (of which there are many). Obviously the golden-poodle mixes can't be registered because they aren't purebred, but pedigrees aside, there are no links to OFA records or any other records for any of the dogs listed. Also: There are so many "immediately available" puppies on that website. These people must produce a whole lot of litters to have that many "left-overs". It's heartbreaking ... And: Schnoodles? Quote from the website: "We want the same blocky, teddy bear look as we get in our Goldendoodles, so we choose our parents carefully for that winning combination that will give us those square heads and short little noses." Note that there is no mention of choosing parents because of their nice temperaments or because they are from healthy lines with good structure, or because their trainability has been demonstrated ...

A whole website dedicated to mixed-breed pups with unpredictable traits on sale for astronomical amounts of money, able to be shipped wherever you like, at your convenience ... Beam me up, Scotty.

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh. But as someone who owns purebred dogs of the two breeds used to produce these doodles, I'm offended by the whole commercial doodle thing. I have nothing against mixed breed dogs; I've owned several wonderful ones in my lifetime and my daughter will be looking for a rescue/shelter dog as her next agility dog, when she finishes university. My problem is with the people who produce mixed breed dogs commercially.

Anyway. I hope you find a dog that will fit nicely into your household. I second the suggestion above that a miniature poodle (not a toy poodle) might be a good choice, if you don't mind the extensive grooming needs of its non-shedding coat.

 

[JerseyChris]

Isn't that what wives are for?
Christmas is almost here guys.

You're a savage.. 😝

 

[ScoutTheGolden]

Hello Golden Enthusiasts.

I'm a perspective golden purchaser trying to decide on a breed and a breeder. I love goldens. I think they are the most beautiful dogs with the best kid-friendly temperament for my 7 yo daughter. However, I also love having a clean house. I do not exercise every day. I have a large back yard with a creek behind it and a medium sized fenced in area that is currently overgrown, but could be re-worked to be a play area. I'm in constant inner conflict. I am leaning towards a golden and hoping that bathing once a week, doing the forceful blowing thing, and buying all the brushes will help offset the shedding. However, since you guys have some opinions about golden crosses, could you give me your feedback on a particular doodle breeder? I'm just curious after reading so many posts about crosses on here. A doodle breeder I researched and am considering, Moss Creek Goldendoodles, has beautiful golden parents on their website with all the major health clearances. They report that a lot of their dogs go on to be therapy dogs and their Owner's FB Group members validate this claim. They seem to produce at least some calm, even tempered dogs according to the owners (There are 5000 members in the FB group). I know that the ppl on this forum say that no reputable golden breeder would ever sell their dog to a doodle breeder. So I'm curious if this is true, how they would have obtained their golden retrievers? (None of the moms that they actually proposed to me were on their website and I did not see their health clearances. However, the owner said that it was because they had not had a chance to add these moms to the website yet.) The puppies are $3500.

Have you looked at your local Golden Retriever Rescue? An adult or older dog might be a good idea for you. You would have a good idea of their temperament and energy level, exercise needs, and you'll skip the landshark puppy phase that could be a lot to deal with for a 7 year old. You'll still have the shedding to deal with, but not the potty training. And a rescue is going to ask for a much lower fee to rehome an adult Golden.

 

[Ontariodogsitter]

It's great to hear from somebody who can support the theory with actual experience @Emmdenn
I am not even sure what the dog hair discussion is about.
We have had in turn, GR and Samoyed, Great Dane and Rottweiler,'and Akita and Lab cross.
Now Lab cross an GR, I do not see any difference in the amount of dog hair around the house.
The dogs never get bathed, get brushed every other day, never go to a groomer, and I vacuum sporadically
I consider my house fairly clean...
not once when we were deciding on taking on a dog, did shedding come up...

 

[FurdogDad]

It's great to hear from somebody who can support the theory with actual experience @Emmdenn
I am not even sure what the dog hair discussion is about.
We have had in turn, GR and Samoyed, Great Dane and Rottweiler,'and Akita and Lab cross.
Now Lab cross an GR, I do not see any difference in the amount of dog hair around the house.
The dogs never get bathed, get brushed every other day, never go to a groomer, and I vacuum sporadically
I consider my house fairly clean...
not once when we were deciding on taking on a dog, did shedding come up...
View attachment 898286

Shed happens........

 

[DevWind]

Isn't that what wives are for?
Christmas is almost here guys.
View attachment 898282

And by the look on her face, it's possibly the last gift he'll ever give.

 

[DevWind]

NO DOODLE BREEDER IS ETHICAL. Period. Step away.
Get a miniature poodle from a responsible breeder. Mini poodles are LOVELY and sound like exactly what you want. They do not shed or smell, they are very clean, they are adorable and wicked smart, they are active if you want to be active but snuggly if you want to just chill.

I have to agree with Anney here. I had a mini poodle before I got my first golden. He was a great little dog!

 

[Prism Goldens]

To your question as to how a doodle breeder gets the Golden to breed- they either lie, and break their contract, or they buy crappy Golden lines. There isn't a good breeder in the country who'd allow cross breeding. Since offspring are not registered, there is no need for full registration. And since the info on the parents is so vague, there's no way to verify any of it or ID them. Call name and 'clear' mean absolutely nothing. IF you can get registered names (if they were ever even registered) then you can check all those 'clear' ratings which I'd bet you are prelims IF they are even done. I lean to thinking moss creek took Cora and JoDee to Dr Wallace whoever that is as puppies and good ol Doc said they were good.. Normal cardiac also means nothing. And no eyes are reported. The using of "OFA/Wallace" when the likelihood OFA never saw these films is a lie.
Get a miniature poodle.
That'll do it for your hopes and desires around a dog, and it won't be putting dollars in the pocket of this unethical breeder.

 

[iPappy]

Keep in mind if you decide to get a Poodle, a good groomer can keep your dog looking teddy-bear fluffy with a cute round face vs. a traditional patterned Poodle trim with a clean shaven face and shaved feet, if that traditional trim is what's putting you off about Poodles.

 

[Goldens&Friesians]

Having a dog is similar to having a kid. And being a retriever you will have dog toys everywhere because they always like to have something in their mouth. And hair will happen.

Both goldens and poodles are high energy and need exercise. Crossing them doesn’t change that. A fenced area for off leash running is a good thing for either breed. Both breeds will require some dedicated obedience training to be the easy to live with companion you might see other people have.

I am a groomer and while weekly baths, blowouts and brushing will definitely cut down on shedding, don’t think they won’t shed at all. And certain times of the year they will just shed like crazy. Puppies go through a pretty big coat blow around 8 months old or so. Intact Females will blow coat with their cycle. And they generally have 2 big sheds a year (usually spring and fall). All this to say basically don’t expect no hair, there will be hair. But you learn to live with it because goldens are so worth it! My hubby can’t stand hair so I just vacuum pretty frequently and then dogs are not allowed in the bedrooms as I have found that cuts down on the hair on his clothes. If it were up to me my dogs would sleep in the bed, but you have to have a little give and take in a marriage! Also keep in mind that a doodle or poodle will require a lot of brushing too-like way more than a golden. As well as regular professional grooming. Like minimum of every 6-8 weeks. And that would be for a very short/shaved haircut. 3-4 weeks for a longer fluffier haircut. And probably looking at prices ranging from $80 on the lower end to $200+ on the higher end per groom. A lot of that depends on where you live Midwest being a bit less than either coast.

So I went to look at the website and the info they give you on the moms is pretty worthless. Anybody can say their dogs have all those clearances and dna tests, but they fail to provide any registered names so there is no way to verify those statements. The whole website feels very glitz and glamor-ish. Set up like a business trying market something to sell. And that’s ok if that’s what you want. You just have to go into it knowing that the health risks are higher and with cross breeding you can never be sure what your dog will look or act like. And knowing that you are paying just as much or more for that uncertainty as you would for a purebred puppy with verifiable clearances and a pretty good idea of what they will look like. I prefer my puppies to come from breeders who are in it to preserve and better a breed. I prefer to have a pretty good idea of what size, temperament, coat type, structure, etc my dog will have. This is a business meant to maximize product output and sell as many puppies as possible for an income. They do a lot to sound really good, even have some vets behind them apparently. But I have learned from working at a vet clinic that most vets are pretty clueless about what makes a good breeder. (Please don’t take offense if you are one of the vets who does know more about breeders!) They seem to think it’s just about whether someone takes good care of of their dogs or not. And this is nothing against vets! They are simply not trained for that: they are trained for helping sick or injured animals and keeping healthy ones healthy.

Generally speaking I have a pretty low opinion of doodles. Their structure is a wreck-you are combining a thinner finer boned poodle with a bigger boned golden, lab, Bernese, Aussie, whatever. The structures just do not go together well. The only people I can think of who crossbreed responsibly are service dog breeders-they will often cross labs and goldens who have very similar structures to get the exact temperament they are looking for. Doodles coats are all over the place. Some have a more flat golden like coat that sheds. Most have a wavy-curly coat that definitely still sheds sometimes less, sometimes a ton. Some are tightly curled and appear to shed less like a poodle; however, they do still shed-it just gets matted in the curls before it can fall off the dog. I groom a doodle who you literally can’t do anything but shave it because of the undercoat shedding and matting in the curls. I tried once to give it a fuller haircut and just could NOT brush it out (spent 30 minutes brushing just one front leg and decided there was no way I was brushing that whole dog and the owners wouldn’t have been ok with paying what that would’ve been worth!) Most doodles are unruly, untrained, hyper idiots. I think I have groomed 2-3 out of dozens who have not tried to bite me. If you want golden temperament, don’t get a doodle. Honestly only goldens have golden temperaments, there are other breeds that come close, but they also still shed. If shedding is a deal breaker, get a poodle-I always feel like standards have the best temperament of the 3 sizes, no little dog syndrome going on, lol!

My recommendation to anyone considering a doodle is look at poodles and look at goldens (or labs, Aussies, Bernese, etc) and then go with a well-bred purebred of the breed you decide fits your lifestyle best. This forum is a good place to start learning what a good golden breeder looks like and to ask for advice on a litter. Other good options are the Golden Retriever Club of America. If you decide on a poodle or any other breed look into their AKC parent club for breeder referrals and to learn what a good breeder of that breed looks like. Don’t expect a well-bred puppy to be available right now-often the wait is at least 6-12 months.

If you like the idea of a low shedding breed other breeds to consider that are some of them quite rare are Curly coated retrievers, American Water Spaniel, Irish Water Spaniel, Otterhound, Barbet, Lagotto Romagnolo, and Portuguese Water Dog. All have different temperaments and needs so you would need to do your research. But wouldn’t it be more fun to help preserve a more rare breed than help add to the overwhelming number of doodle dogs in the world?

 

[Ann in GA]

I wanted to make sure I came back to this thread as I own/co-own 4 goldens and most of my family members have doodles, my sister just got a well bred standard poodle puppy also.

Every time we are together (my family has a lake house where all 9 family dogs visit) everyone comments on how clean and nice my dogs coats are (usually they actually have not been freshly bathed — they just have nice correct coats). My dogs are in and out of the water, they dry nicely and that’s it. I do my own grooming, which means my grooming costs are just for my own supplies.

The doodles on the other hand— have horrible coats. The get groomed every 6 weeks and it’s at least $200 in our area. Something I didn’t realize about doodle coats are because of the curly mixture of the coat types (golden or lab and poodle) they mat like CRAZY every time they get wet. The ones in my family are constantly getting shave downs because even with brushing they mat SO easily. Another thing about them I find so gross is that all that beard around their mouths gets so filthy and stinky and drips water and saliva all over the place. And it’s always wet and damp. Or full of food smells or dirt. Always. Nothing like a soggy, stinky, dirty beard trying to lick you in the face.

The fluffy, teddy bear paw feet always need to be shaved because they get wet and dirty and yeasty, which the dogs then lick, creating hot spots and fungal growth. So they’ve mostly taken to shaving the feet and face…which means basically they look like standard poodles…

All of the doodles in family— completely unrelated have food allergies and anal gland issues.

So while you may think you’re getting the best of both breeds with a low shedding coat — you’re not. You’re getting a random mix of the breeds which a coat that is NOT easy to maintain and requires constantly brushing, shaving, bathing, expensive grooming appointments and will likely come with allergies and other issues.

A well bred golden with consistent grooming, kept clean and with occasional brushing is WAY easier to maintain. I vacuum once a day and I don’t have hair all over my house. My dogs don’t smell and neither does my house!

Thank you so much for taking the time to respond.

I am completely with you in the disdain of the stinky, wet beards. I've been told that you can trim the beard hair pretty short to avoid this issue as well as to avoid the brown staining from porphyrins that is noticeable around the mouth of white (light colored) doodles. I have heard that some doodle owners use distilled water, ceramic bowls, and some even wipe their dog's mouths after every time they drink to avoid the brown staining. Some have issues with it, some don't.

It's also funny that you mention food allergies because the owner's FB website is full of owners discussing what dog food brand their dog needs and various GI/food allergy issues. No one complains though because they are so in love with their doodles!! I'm curious if your family members love their dogs in spite of this and would get a doodle if they had the choice again. You lost me with anal gland issues . Can't handle that. I did call today to price groomers in the area and it's $80 for a 40 lb doodle and goes up from there "based on behavior issues." A friend got a doodle for her daughter who has severe dog allergies and said she had no idea how much maintenance her coat would be and she basically gets shaved down every time at the groomer because of the mats. No one captions their doodle pictures on IG with "spent 2 hours brushing my dog today." I guess it's just something no one talks about? Or maybe some coats are more challenging than others.

The doodle breeder marketing is misleading because they offer a "custom dog." Do you want a mini, medium, or standard? F1 or F1b? White or parti or tan? Wavy or curly coat? Calm or high energy for an active family? So making these decisions psychologically leads you to believe that you will get what you pay for. And who won't spend extra money to get the exact temperament and size dog they want for their family? But when I look on the FB owner's website, the dogs from the same litter vary drastically from each other - some are a golden phenotype, some are poodle. Coats are all over the place. I suppose the owners can tell from the amount of curl when they are puppies and communicate this to buyers. But I just realized I'm paying for something that is in no way guaranteed or predictable and that's the only reason I was considering paying that price in the first place.

 

[Goldens&Friesians]

Be careful with that custom made stuff. I know of at least 2 doodle owners who got “mini” doodles under the promise of “they won’t get any bigger than 35lbs” and they are both over 80 lbs. And as far as the brushing thing, doodle owners don’t talk about it because they don’t do it. At least that is what I have found to be true as a groomer 99% or the time. Or if they do they are using only a slicker (as opposed to a metal comb making sure they are getting all the way through to the skin) that is getting only the hair on top while the hair underneath is so matted you literally can’t separate it and find skin. Doodle hair is literally the WORST hair to groom. There is a reason they are usually my highest prices grooms.

 

[Ann in GA]

Having a dog is similar to having a kid. And being a retriever you will have dog toys everywhere because they always like to have something in their mouth. And hair will happen.

Both goldens and poodles are high energy and need exercise. Crossing them doesn’t change that. A fenced area for off leash running is a good thing for either breed. Both breeds will require some dedicated obedience training to be the easy to live with companion you might see other people have.

I am a groomer and while weekly baths, blowouts and brushing will definitely cut down on shedding, don’t think they won’t shed at all. And certain times of the year they will just shed like crazy. Puppies go through a pretty big coat blow around 8 months old or so. Intact Females will blow coat with their cycle. And they generally have 2 big sheds a year (usually spring and fall). All this to say basically don’t expect no hair, there will be hair. But you learn to live with it because goldens are so worth it! My hubby can’t stand hair so I just vacuum pretty frequently and then dogs are not allowed in the bedrooms as I have found that cuts down on the hair on his clothes. If it were up to me my dogs would sleep in the bed, but you have to have a little give and take in a marriage! Also keep in mind that a doodle or poodle will require a lot of brushing too-like way more than a golden. As well as regular professional grooming. Like minimum of every 6-8 weeks. And that would be for a very short/shaved haircut. 3-4 weeks for a longer fluffier haircut. And probably looking at prices ranging from $80 on the lower end to $200+ on the higher end per groom. A lot of that depends on where you live Midwest being a bit less than either coast.

So I went to look at the website and the info they give you on the moms is pretty worthless. Anybody can say their dogs have all those clearances and dna tests, but they fail to provide any registered names so there is no way to verify those statements. The whole website feels very glitz and glamor-ish. Set up like a business trying market something to sell. And that’s ok if that’s what you want. You just have to go into it knowing that the health risks are higher and with cross breeding you can never be sure what your dog will look or act like. And knowing that you are paying just as much or more for that uncertainty as you would for a purebred puppy with verifiable clearances and a pretty good idea of what they will look like. I prefer my puppies to come from breeders who are in it to preserve and better a breed. I prefer to have a pretty good idea of what size, temperament, coat type, structure, etc my dog will have. This is a business meant to maximize product output and sell as many puppies as possible for an income. They do a lot to sound really good, even have some vets behind them apparently. But I have learned from working at a vet clinic that most vets are pretty clueless about what makes a good breeder. (Please don’t take offense if you are one of the vets who does know more about breeders!) They seem to think it’s just about whether someone takes good care of of their dogs or not. And this is nothing against vets! They are simply not trained for that: they are trained for helping sick or injured animals and keeping healthy ones healthy.

Generally speaking I have a pretty low opinion of doodles. Their structure is a wreck-you are combining a thinner finer boned poodle with a bigger boned golden, lab, Bernese, Aussie, whatever. The structures just do not go together well. The only people I can think of who crossbreed responsibly are service dog breeders-they will often cross labs and goldens who have very similar structures to get the exact temperament they are looking for. Doodles coats are all over the place. Some have a more flat golden like coat that sheds. Most have a wavy-curly coat that definitely still sheds sometimes less, sometimes a ton. Some are tightly curled and appear to shed less like a poodle; however, they do still shed-it just gets matted in the curls before it can fall off the dog. I groom a doodle who you literally can’t do anything but shave it because of the undercoat shedding and matting in the curls. I tried once to give it a fuller haircut and just could NOT brush it out (spent 30 minutes brushing just one front leg and decided there was no way I was brushing that whole dog and the owners wouldn’t have been ok with paying what that would’ve been worth!) Most doodles are unruly, untrained, hyper idiots. I think I have groomed 2-3 out of dozens who have not tried to bite me. If you want golden temperament, don’t get a doodle. Honestly only goldens have golden temperaments, there are other breeds that come close, but they also still shed. If shedding is a deal breaker, get a poodle-I always feel like standards have the best temperament of the 3 sizes, no little dog syndrome going on, lol!

My recommendation to anyone considering a doodle is look at poodles and look at goldens (or labs, Aussies, Bernese, etc) and then go with a well-bred purebred of the breed you decide fits your lifestyle best. This forum is a good place to start learning what a good golden breeder looks like and to ask for advice on a litter. Other good options are the Golden Retriever Club of America. If you decide on a poodle or any other breed look into their AKC parent club for breeder referrals and to learn what a good breeder of that breed looks like. Don’t expect a well-bred puppy to be available right now-often the wait is at least 6-12 months.

If you like the idea of a low shedding breed other breeds to consider that are some of them quite rare are Curly coated retrievers, American Water Spaniel, Irish Water Spaniel, Otterhound, Barbet, Lagotto Romagnolo, and Portuguese Water Dog. All have different temperaments and needs so you would need to do your research. But wouldn’t it be more fun to help preserve a more rare breed than help add to the overwhelming number of doodle dogs in the world?

I've enjoyed reading everyone's responses. It's so informative. Just to post a synopsis and response here...

This issue is still sort of mind boggling to me. There are two groups of dog owners with completely different experiences and perspectives. There is you guys who I respect so much...well, those of you who offered respectful, informative posts and not misogynistic, not-funny, degrading posts...And then there are 5,200 goldendoodle owners on the Moss Creek Owner's FB page that are in love with their doodles and would never have another type of dog. They have coined the phrase "double doodling" which means that the owners loved their first doodle so much they went back and got a second doodle from MC. It's a legitimate thing. They would not go back and spend another $3500 if their dog was as terrible as everyone here says. I've spoken with several doodle owners from the site that were prior golden retriever owners but decided to get a doodle and would never go back to a golden. This is a direct quote: "We've had golden retrievers for 40 years we're obsessed with our Graham [doodle] smart lovable no shedding at all!! Goes to the groomer once every 6 weeks." "I'll take a doodle any day over the golden now." There are several posts about hip dysplasia findings in dogs, food allergies, skin allergies. The breeders host an annual "doodle romp" where hundreds of their doodle owners come from all over the US to meet together and have their dogs play together. They are on YouTube. People that have neurotic, lousy temperament dogs would not do this.

I agree with you 100% that doodles are not bettering the golden retriever breed and I understand that more now. And it makes sense that there is such a lack of consistency between doodles in every area. I guess I am just pushing back with the comment that "9/10 doodles" have poor temperaments. Poor temperament can be attributable to the specific doodle "breeder" just like with a poor golden breeder and there is clear evidence that this breeder has been successful in breeding great temperament doodles for the most part.

Goldens and Friesia > It's interesting to hear you say that GR are "a rare breed" when they are the third most common dog breed in the US. Do you mean that it is rare to find GRs that are from an ethical breeder these days?

 

[Ann in GA]

My aunt has a couple of rehomed doodles and my gosh do they stink. They are black, so you can't see the red fur from the yeast, but you can definitely smell it.

Oh wow. Okay.

 

[GoldenDude]

Creating mutts for profit is unethical, but if you like the breeder, you should get one of her doodles.

 

[SRW]

Creating mutts for profit is unethical, but if you like the breeder, you should get one of her doodles.

You think it's okay to support an unethical breeder if you like them?