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It seems like I have been reading a lot of posts lately from upset owners whose dog was greeted by another leashed dog. I feel badly reading some of them because I think I have been on the other end of the greeting... :uhoh:

Let me start by saying our last dog, a boxer, was not properly socialized as a pup. She was our first dog and after being repeatedly picked on at the dog park in our old neighborhood as a puppy we stopped taking her around any dogs. Of course we paid for that bad choice throughout the rest of her life, she was very dog aggressive with any dog she didn't know, especially on leash.

With Sam we started very early with his training and socialization trying to make sure that he would grow up a well socialized dog-friendly pup! Now anytime I have him out on a walk, at the park, at Petco or whatever I will allow him to greet other leashed dogs. I almost always ask the owner if it's alright for him to say hello, but sometimes he gets there before I finish my sentence. With our boxer I was always on guard when another dog approached & made sure the other owner knew that she was not dog friendly, so I guess I expect the other owners to do the same thing... In thinking about this I guess I just assumed that if they are walking a dog on a loose leash & don’t pull back when Sam approaches that they are ok with him saying hello.

We love Sam to meet as many dogs as possible so that we keep up with his socialization, we don't ever want to end up where we were with our boxer. For those of you that do not allow your dogs to greet other dogs on leash, can you tell me why? And how do you handle a friendly dog that comes up to say hello? Is there something that I should be doing differently? I now have this vision of all the neighborhood dog owners posting on their various websites about my poorly mannered greetings...
:eek:
 

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I think you're doing the right thing. If you ask the owners if they can visit, that is all you can do. If their dog is aggressive, I'm sure they don't bring it to Petco where they will inevitably be put in a bad situation.
 

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I'm very glad you are asking this- it's an interesting question.

Since we both work full time, but cannot afford full time doggy daycare, Sienna is in her crate most week days, save for our doggy helper letting her out to play/pee midday. She has always been SUPER friendly, but more of a people dog than doggy dog. As she matured, just after she turned one, she all of a sudden started having issues on leash with other dogs- more of a nervousness that just started out of the blue. It was very upseting, but after the dust settled I have tried my hardest to remain calm, loose leash when she meets other dogs so as not to influence her.

We did bring her to doggy daycare after this all started and are seeing that she is nervous at first, but calms down after a bit. Still more a people dog, although she will try to play with humans like they were a dog :uhoh:

Sorry for rambling, but wanted to say... we have trails all around where we live and everyone is walking their dogs. I would say you are doing everything right. I make eye contact with the owners and see what they are doing with their dog. If they hold tighter on the leash I will ask if they are okay to greet. Sometimes they might say hello but keep walking. For me, if someone just calls out "is he/she friendly" would signal to me that they are okay with the dogs meeting or if they don't pull back on the leash. I always ask if the dog is approaching Sienna. I do mention that Sienna can be nervous, as she might let out a sharp "backoff" bark/yipe after the first initial nose sniff.

Did you have an experience where someone was upset? I think you are doing everything right! I do hope you will be able to come to the Rescue Walk.
 

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The proper manners are to ask. Sounds lke you are doing that except when you said your dog sometimes gets there first. This is what you need to deal with... train your dog so he is under your control and doesn't get ahead of you.

I think the complaints were about people who don't ask first. Those people just allow their dog free reign and have no control obviously.

You would think people who have aggressive dogs would either control them or not go to places where their dog would act aggressively.But unfortunately they don't.

I do have a golden who doesn't like dogs he doesn't know. I do have the right to be in my own yard and walk my dog without him being assaulted by other dogs, friendly or not.
But if my dog attacked another dog, even if HE was the one assaulted, it is Gunner and myself who would pay for it. So I am always on guard when I have him out in the yard or when we rarely have him "out" where other dogs could be. Plus we took the time and energy to train him so he obeys us.
 

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Sounds like you are doing great. We have had more issues with the smaller dogs.. mommy holds them over big dogs head, etc. Bleck!
I ask the owner if their dog is friendly.. You will be surprised at how many people do take unsociable dogs out! Rusty had a bad encounter with one while he was just 4 months old.. and we had to work like mad to over come it! If the owner says the dog is friendly, I take a deep breath, tell ours to " say hello " and make sure you give them a loose leash. Don't let it become tangled around legs, etc. in case you need to haul him out.. but you don't want tension felt down the lead, either. Be watchful for dog language.. Butt sniffing is the best.. be leery of stiffness or direct stares. If I don't like the body language of the other dog I say " okay ! " do a 180 and walk away. We also say " good hello " corny.. I know . :curtain:
 

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boxer. For those of you that do not allow your dogs to greet other dogs on leash, can you tell me why? And how do you handle a friendly dog that comes up to say hello? Is there something that I should be doing differently? I now have this vision of all the neighborhood dog owners posting on their various websites about my poorly mannered greetings...
:eek:

I don't as a rule, allow Ticket to socialize with other dogs when he's on leash, it depends on the dog and situation though. If it's an intact male, he doesn't get to say hi. If it's a bitch or a calm boy, and they're relaxed, then he's usually fine. The girls are fine with almost anything, but if I have all three dogs on leash with me, then no, we don't socialize, they're too much of a pack and it's too risky (mainly because Ticket doesn't tend to care for any boys looking at 'his girls').

If a friendly dog comes up to say hello, generally they'll approach in a polite manner. If they come charging up then I take the offence if I can and tell them to 'git' in hopes they put the brakes on and think about it before rushing up to french kiss anybody without saying hello first. If a dog comes up that I think may have an issue or cause a problem and I have Ticket with me, I watch him closely and will either drop the leash so there's no tension from me, or take his muzzle and have him do attention work while telling the other person to not allow their dog too close. If the dog is by themselves, and pushy, I have been known to use the end of the leash to snap at them and back them off if needed - I figure it's better than allowing a full out fight or attack.

I think the main thing for you to teach is to have your dog sit while you ask the owner if it's ok for your dog to visit, and THEN allow them to visit. If your pup bolts for the other dog, turn around and walk away - rude manners = no visiting. Try again from further away so he can try again (you may want to get some doggie pals to help you with this, even if it's a dog he knows he should listen to you). When you sit him look at the other dog - is that dog looking like they WANT to meet him, eat him or avoid him? When you do allow him to visit, you can give a 'go say hi' command and then keep the leash loose - so there's no tension.

It does take a lot to learn how to 'speak' dog and know how to handle things, but in general teaching your dog that it's not ok to just run up to every other dog is a good thing. If he does it to the wrong dog it could be very bad, and he could start to have issues (hey, for years I've run up and french kissed every dog I've seen, then one tried to rip my head off... what the heck??? maybe I should rip dogs head's off too, first!).

Lana
 

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I think what you're doing is totally great. You're asking if your dog can meet the other dog, which is very polite. :) I complained once about people having their dog "meet" my puppy without really asking me... they just sort of let their dog approach Flora, and since she is very timid about other dogs, she freaked out. If I were to come across you and your dog on a walk and you asked if our dogs could meet, I would most likely say yes. I just don't like the unannounced greetings.
 

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I think the main thing for you to teach is to have your dog sit while you ask the owner if it's ok for your dog to visit, and THEN allow them to visit. If your pup bolts for the other dog, turn around and walk away - rude manners = no visiting. Try again from further away so he can try again (you may want to get some doggie pals to help you with this, even if it's a dog he knows he should listen to you). When you sit him look at the other dog - is that dog looking like they WANT to meet him, eat him or avoid him? When you do allow him to visit, you can give a 'go say hi' command and then keep the leash loose - so there's no tension.
Boom! This is fantastic advice. Teach your dog he needs to sit before he greets or walk by if no greeting is allowed. That's one of the basics in the Canine Good Citizen test, and it's important that your dog is under your control at all times. The standard etiquette is to ask the owner if it's OK before you allow the dogs within a few feet of each other. If you're not asking, or you're not in control enough to ask, it's something to work on. It's important to teach your dog that dragging you always results the opposite of what he wants by making sure he doesn't get a visit if he tries it that way. However, if he sits and otherwise behaves, then he occasionally does get to greet. That approach will powerfully reinforce the good behavior and eliminate the bad.

Just tell the other owner that you're working on good, controlled greetings and would they mind helping you with that training. Most people are really nice. And if the person isn't nice...well, their dog probably isn't safely trained anyway.

We use the "OK, say hi" command, but it only works because we've practiced walking by other dogs without pulling or interacting hundreds of times. It takes friends who are training their dogs too, as well as immense patience and good timing with leash pops to interrupt the dog's attention on the other dog.
 

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Don't feel like if he dosen't continue to say "hi" all the time he will become agressive like your boxer. He is more likely to develop problem by being atacked becase he ran up into another dogs face. I have a dog that not truly dog agressive but dosen't like other dogs up in her face. In a store situation the owner may be distracted looking at somthing and not see you comming so dosen't have a chance to say somthing before Sam in in their dogs face. I would recomend that you teach sam that he is not allowed to go to another dog unless you give him permission. Maybe its just the obediance person side of me and like you having been the owner of a reactive dog I hate to be on the reciving side of "friendly" dogs.

JMO but I think there are some misconceptions about "socilizing". Socalizing in puppyhood and beyond that in the training to be a canine good citizen. Dog will not become agressive toward other dogs if they don't regulary get a chance to "say hi". Like I said JMO
 

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I don't understand some of the statements. I'm getting the impression that people should not be taking their unsociable/dog agressive dogs out for a walk? They are all still dogs, they need to be excercised as much as other more friendly dogs do they not?
 

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I don't understand some of the statements. I'm getting the impression that people should not be taking their unsociable/dog agressive dogs out for a walk? They are all still dogs, they need to be excercised as much as other more friendly dogs do they not?
Yes the do. The problem with those of use who have reactive dogs are those who have "friendly" dogs. I have a dog who dose not like other dogs in her face. I have worked very very hard to get to comfterable around other dogs. I show her in Obediance and having her acosted by another dog can be a huge set back. So I have to be Very carfull about where she goes so she dosent' come in contact with untrained dogs. I can't even count the number of time the "other" dog has been at the end of its leash jumping, barking and lunging at her. And its ignorant owner if I try and keep her away tell me "but he's friendly and just wants to say HI". Umm I will let a calm dog whos owner has control let their dog have a nice positve interaction with mine but I'm not about to let your out of control dog into mines face. So its really hard because she can't go places becaues of other owners who don't control where thier dogs noses go.

I don't see very many truly dog agressive dogs.(a dog who just sees another dog and truly wants to hurt it). Most dogs are ractive to other dogs in their space.(more of a back off reaction than I'm going to get you kind) So dogs who charge into another dogs space can caues problems for those of us who have "space issue" dogs. It limits us to where we can take them and yes its unfortanate. But with many thing safty comes first.
 

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If i've got mine out and we are walking in the lead, then I try to avoid "doggy greetings", for the simple fact that Quinn will become VERY excited and it will take me some time to calm him, and it does annoy me if others let their dogs come rushing up. If it is someone we know, then i make him sit before they talk to him. If we are in the field and he is off the lead, I am trying (and getting there slowly) not to go running off to other dogs - one day he could meet trouble.
 

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They need to be worked with...around people and dogs they already know before being "let loose" on strangers (I mean that kindly....not to imply that the dog is a hazard).

First teach the dog to heel. Then sit beside you when you stop. If someone comes up, keep the dog sitting at your side. Talk to the person...then let the person pet the dog (or even offer a treat that YOU give the person). Once you have that down pat....

Then, have that same person walk up with another dog on lead. A dog your dog knows and likes would be best. Have the person keep his dog sitting by his side and you do the same, while the two of you talk. Then pet one another's dog...keeping yours sitting.

Keep doing this every day if possible. Different dogs and people, if possible. Set up a plan with friends. Meet in different place.

If you can do that part every day...you can have 2 15 minute sessions with the dog on the heeling/sitting/staying every day. Incorporate it into daily walks. 10-15 minute training sessions is all you need. Train first part of the walk...then let them sniff afterwards. Always treat while training at first.

Obedience training would be best, but you might need private sessions first.

Good luck! You can overcome this!
 

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If your dog is rushing me and my on-leash dogs, I'm going to stop your dog before he gets to mine. That's just rude dog behavior (and rude owner behavior to let it happen) and my older female will issue an appropriate smack-down on your rude-rusher. More than likely, however, my dog will be the one who is looked at as being "aggressive." That's not fair to her.

If you can approcah us in a reasonably calm manner, I'm okay with a brief greeting so long as everyone is on a loose leash and nobody "camps out" up my dogs' butts for very long.

At the same time, I don't believe we have to stop and "say hi" to every dog we pass. I don't shake every human's hand as I walk down the street. My dogs don't have to either.
 

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WOW! Great advice everyone, thank you!

I will work on the sit before being released to greet. I never thought of it as an obedience issue, I thought all friendly dogs sniffed each other & said hello... Again this is only the second dog we've ever had & I'm just so happy that he likes everyone!!

Sienna's mom: I don't THINK I've ever had a time when the owner was upset, but I was worried I wasn't using proper etiquette & annoying my neighbors. Sam is also more of a people dog, he will give a new dog a quick sniff & then roll over at the owner’s feet waiting for a belly rub...I KNOW, I KNOW work on obedience training :doh: But really who doesn’t love a goofy, fluffy, golden retriever upside down on their shoes??? Don't worry; you'll get this full treatment at the walk!!

jnmarr: Love the "good hello" I totally talk to Sam like he's one of my boys..."Did you meet a new friend Sammy? He seemed like a nice doggy?"...so no need to be embarrassed!

Bender, tippykayak & ardeagold: GREAT ADVICE, thank you!!

Bizzy: Thank you that was exactly what I was worried about. I didn't even think about the issues he would have if he was attacked, which would be my fault anyway!

kdmarsh: Thank you for your point of view, I hadn't thought about how the puppy feels. Sam has met a few puppies & my thought was how nice for the puppy to meet such a puppy-friendly dog. Kind of arrogant of me I realize now! :eek:

Quizini: I guess Sam takes after me...I say Hi to everyone we pass, I think it's a Portland thing! Funny, I lived in the Bay Area for a while & the one thing I couldn't get used to is people not talking to each other. I heard from many clients from CA (I'm a realtor) that it's hard for them to get used to talking to EVERYONE they pass up here...we're an overly friendly bunch!!:wavey:
 

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Steph, I COMPLETELY agree. My dog does NOT have to say hi to every dog he meets. I really think that leads can really mess up natural doggy posture and behavior. If your dog is rushing my dog and the lead is pulled tightly, that dog is sending mixed signals to my dog. If Vito reacted negatively to being rushed (Steph is again right) why should my dog be the bad guy??

However, I do like Vito to meet the occasional dog and quite often it has to be on lead. I pick and chose the dog very carefully. I will put Vito into a sit stay, and ALWAYS ask. Sitting nicely=saying hello. Lunging=walking the other way.
I hate when people ask but their dogs face is already up Vito's butt. Uh, geez, thanks?
 

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One of the problems with a lot of goldens is that goofy thing they do annoys the heck out of a lot of dogs. There's a 'rude dog' article somewhere out there, I'll look it up later when the kiddos are in bed (it's in Storee's puppy binder in the office which just scares me), but it explains it quite well. Goldens (many of them anyway) have no idea that not every other dog is going to love them to death when they come and pounce on their face in a display of love.

Ticket is reactive, he will not go after another dog, but some dogs will set him off and can be an issue. I did classes once with a sheltie in the group (he hates shelties) and it was a pain because the sheltie's owner never paid attention to her dog, had him at the end of the leash sniffing Ticket's butt over and over again. Ticket would stiffen up and would listen and walk away with me each time, but for most dogs the stiffen up would be a hint to not do it again - I know watching him at the off leash park, he's done that and I've called him in and generally the other dog goes 'got it, he's not fond of me' and they don't go near him again. Goldens though tend to be the 'oh but you must love me!' type and bounce back into that sort of thing again.

Lana
 

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I think there a couple of things at play. First, Goldens and Labs greet each other in a manner that is considered very rude in the doggy world- very front on, very in your face, etc. They like it, and they are too enthusiastic to notice otherwise. But it really can get them into trouble with other breeds.

Another part of the issue is the timing of the greeting- a lot of the time, if you just say, "is he friendly" or simply evaluate for a "leash pullback", the greeting is already going on and there may be a problem developing. If you do the sit, confirm with the owner, and then greet, you really can get a good idea of the situation (you really don't want to overwhelm a normally friendly but fairly shy small dog with a bouncy golden tween male, for example).

The other is, you just don't know about other dogs that you don't really know. There is a big difference between "socializing" your dog and allowing them to greet dogs that you don't know if they have been vaccinated, exposed to various illnesses (ie, kennel cough, parvo), are dog reactive, are people reactive, etc. I have always preferred to socialize my dogs through classes where there are entrance requirements and through puppy play dates than taking my chances with random street greetings.
 

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I think you're doing the right thing. If you ask the owners if they can visit, that is all you can do. If their dog is aggressive, I'm sure they don't bring it to Petco where they will inevitably be put in a bad situation.
I'm not so sure I'd count on people not to put their dogs into bad situations. I see lots of dogs put into situations that they shouldn't be put into - including dog reactive dogs at petsmart or our local pet food place. I don't let other dogs greet my dogs - period - and my dogs are well socialized critters that get along with everyone. I also do not allow them to greet other dogs.

I'm a little concerned with the OP's commont that "I ask but sometimes he gets there before they answer" - that is a dog that I would body block from making contact with mine - and this often puts people off. I generally hear something like "He just wants to say hi" (See this article by Suzanne Clothier: http://www.livingwithdogs.us/articles/He-just-wants-to-say-hi.pdf) - the behavior is no more socially appropriate in dogs than with humans and you have no idea what the dog you are running into is like. You're setting him up to be bitten through no fault of his own. There are also the folks that will tell you their dogs are "fine" and then aren't. Over the years I have very little faith in the average pet person to really have a good handle on what their dogs are (and aren't). I see so much really worrisome doggie posture at my local pet food place - and I'm astonished that there aren't dog fights.

I would suggest that you put some control on his greeting behavior and rethink about whether or not you really want him to think he gets to greet every dog he meets. It sounds like he's a happy, friendly confident boy already - he doesn't need bad experiences.

Erica
 

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Magica Goldens
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I don't understand some of the statements. I'm getting the impression that people should not be taking their unsociable/dog agressive dogs out for a walk? They are all still dogs, they need to be excercised as much as other more friendly dogs do they not?
I think the key here is knowing your dog and the situation you are putting him into. If you have a dog-reactive or aggressive dog you should not bring him to a dog park or a pet store for socialization purposes - it's irresponsible. Of course he needs exercise - so you need to think about where and when you take him places - maybe there's no one at the dog park at 6am, maybe there's a corner of the park that you have to hike into (off the beaten path) and you keep your dog on a flexi. The same thing would be said about an overly friendly dog that isn't going to respond to a recall. If I see a dog barreling at my dogs off leash I don't care if he's friendly - he's out of control - I will take him out before he makes contact with my dogs - that's my job to protect my dogs - and it's all of our jobs to make sure that our dogs don't affect other people and their dogs.

Erica
 
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