Golden Retriever Dog Forums banner

To titer or not to titer...?

2K views 24 replies 9 participants last post by  hotel4dogs 
#1 ·
Riley goes in for his annual checkup tomorrow morning and I'm more than a little confused about titers.
Some people I've talked to think it's a good idea to have them run every year and some people think that they're basically just a waste of money since they measure antibodies and not the memory cells (which are supposed to be the true measure of immunity??)

I'm trying to decide if it would be better to titer, or just go with something like a three-year protocol.
We did vaccinate last year, at 1 year of age, but now that he's 2, I don't know which way to go. I definitely don't want to vaccinate if it isn't necessary, but I don't want to take chances and find out the hard way that he's not fully immune to something, either.

Are titers really a good indicator of immunity?
 
#3 ·
In a word, no, they're not a very good indicator of protection for some viruses, while they are an excellent indicator for others.
Clear as mud, right?
 
#6 ·
Clear as mud, right?
Ha - yeah, just about.


moverking said:
You're right about not measuring the 'memory cells'. The body can burp up antibodies not seen on titers unless stimulated by a particular antigen.
Okay, good. She said pretty much the same thing this morning. She said her biggest problem with titers is that you can get the 'false low' and end up vaccinating when it isn't necessary, anyway. (Our previous vet didn't even know how to read titer results, so I'm still in the habit of doing my homework before and after an office visit.) When she had seen Gunner's chart before, and commented on the titers instead of annual vaccines, she was just happy that we didn't vaccinate every year. She had a few words for the vets who still push it and still hit them with the big combo shots to boot. (Have I mentioned that I love this woman?)

Except for the Lepto, which she said still pretty much has to be given every year, she likes to go with basically a three-year rotation, if I understood her correctly. Like this year, he got the Lepto and Parvo. Next year, he'll get the Lepto and Distemper, etc., unless I would decide to go with even less than that. And when he needs the rabies vaccine, she suggested that we give it a few weeks apart from any others.

And on a side note - Riley did great! I was so proud of him. He's still pretty defensive because of the last place, so we went ahead and used a muzzle while she was drawing blood, just to play it safe, but we probably wouldn't have needed it. She just let me hold him and he was really good about the whole thing. Took a treat from her and everything. I was shocked! :)
 
#4 ·
You're right about not measuring the 'memory cells'. The body can burp up antibodies not seen on titers unless stimulated by a particular antigen.

I had real doubts about this when I first read about it in CDC literature about vaccinating dialysis staff against Hep B...they were suggesting stopping the booster vaccines after the required level of immunity was reached, even if it dropped to non-immune levels, because the genetic cell 'memory' could produce enough antibody if exposed to the antigen.
Didn't stand up in a court of law if an employee contracted Hep B with a history of 'previous' immunity.

My plan is Rabies every three (law) and then I research my locality for documented disease and frequency. This year Lepto has jumped, so I will probably get antibody levels done for this (and it's gazillion serovars) and vaccinate.
 
#12 ·
My plan is Rabies every three (law) and then I research my locality for documented disease and frequency. This year Lepto has jumped, so I will probably get antibody levels done for this (and it's gazillion serovars) and vaccinate.

Where do you go to find the documentation in your area? I know it's probably different since I'm in Canada, but it might give me a starting place to look. I just checked the CFHS site (Canada Federation of Humane Societies) but didn't see anything there. I was kind of hoping they'd give me a link to follow.
 
#5 ·
I don't titer but I do vaccinate every 3 years, after the first year-just me playing it safe. Luckily, Wisconsin only requires rabies every 3 years.

However, if my guys are out and about in the fields and woods a lot, I will vaccinate for lepto accordingly. I think the lepto vaccination is only good for 6 months at best.
 
#7 ·
I don't titer but I do vaccinate every 3 years, after the first year-just me playing it safe. Luckily, Wisconsin only requires rabies every 3 years.
Yeah, I'm all for playing it safe! I don't want to overdo it, but I don't want him coming down with something that's preventable, either.
She said that some studies are showing full immunity for life, after the first year booster and while they might very well be on to something, she feels that it's still a roll of the dice and doesn't necessarily mean that every dog is going to be immune to everything for life.
So, I think this one strikes just about the right balance for me. She doesn't like to overdo it, but she still wants to be cautious.
 
#10 ·
my vet also does the 3 year rotation, although he's I think he's rethinking the 3 year parvo for "high risk dogs" due to the outbreaks of parvo at shows.
 
#11 ·
It's really good to hear that other vets follow this protocol, too. As much as I like this woman, I still have some trust issues because of the vets we've had in the past.

When would a dog be considered "high risk" for Parvo? I admit, I know next to nothing about the transmission of that. Does it require direct contact with infected dogs, or is it something that can be picked up just strolling the neighborhood and coming into contact with urine or feces? That would concern me, since no one around here bothers to clean up after their dogs.
 
#16 ·
FWIW, almost all of the dogs I get here at the pet hotel are on the 3 year vaccination protocol except the "high risk" dogs.
 
#18 ·
Gunner is now on the three year protocol because my vet doesn't think titiers are correct.

So this year, in Jan. I think I will have him get distemper/ parvo. Lepto isn't big here and my dogs aren't around wild animals unless a squirrel or possum had it in our yard. My dogs are never around other dogs but one could pee/poop in our yard on a walk which does happen! Plus Lepto vaccine is like the flu vaccine. There are hundreds of variations of Lepto and the vaccine covers 7. Plus it is the vaccine with the most reactions.

My vet doesn't think dogs over age 9 need vacs. so Selka is no longer getting them.

Then I will get his rabies (every 3 years here) in the spring.
 
#19 ·
Gunner is now on the three year protocol because my vet doesn't think titiers are correct.

So this year, in Jan. I think I will have him get distemper/ parvo. Lepto isn't big here and my dogs aren't around wild animals unless a squirrel or possum had it in our yard. My dogs are never around other dogs but one could pee/poop in our yard on a walk which does happen! Plus Lepto vaccine is like the flu vaccine. There are hundreds of variations of Lepto and the vaccine covers 7. Plus it is the vaccine with the most reactions.

My vet doesn't think dogs over age 9 need vacs. so Selka is no longer getting them.

Then I will get his rabies (every 3 years here) in the spring.
Yeah, the Lepto vaccine makes me nervous too, but I figure my guys are probably at greater risk from exposure to Lepto than they are from a bad reaction to the vaccine. We have raccoons and possums all over the place, here. And squirrels - ugh. Those fluffy little rats are everywhere! And she did say that they're seeing Lepto cases a lot more frequently now, in this area, so I'll take the chance. Still makes me nervous, though!

My Gunner probably won't be getting vaccinated at all, anymore. He's going to be 7 next month (was vaccinated annually for the first five years of his life - before we knew better) and now, with his EPI, I just don't think it's a good idea. I'm still on the fence about the Lepto with him. She said we could talk about next spring, when he goes in again, but she doesn't want to give him any of the other vaccines.
 
#20 ·
Sammy and Barley were given two sets of yearly boosters and then I titered them for the following two years. Titers always looked good but this year were lower than last year. Barley is going to get shots next year (making it three years since his last set) After that I will probably skip a year and then titer the following year.

Mira got titered last year rather than getting a one year booster, her titers looked good so no shots. So she has only had a puppy series. I will get her shots next year as well, then follow the same plan above as Barley.
 
#23 ·
yes it is, and it's sort of the "gold standard" vaccination protocol right now. The key feature, however, is as follows: (except from that webpage)

"....These are only general guidelines, as the vaccine types recommended and the frequency of vaccination vary depending on the lifestyle of the pet being vaccinated, i.e. indoor vs outdoor pets, travel plans, kennel/boarding plans, and underlying disease conditions such as immune-mediated diseases or pre-existing infections such as FIV infection. Because these factors may change over time, we recommend the vaccination plan for each individual pet be decided by the owner at routine annual examinations, following a discussion between the veterinarian and the client regarding the animal's lifestyle in the year ahead.... "

which I think is awesome that the veterinary profession is finally recognizing that the vaccination requirements for fifi, who never leaves the house and is never outside offleash, only out for 5 minutes to potty,
are very different than for Brutus, who hunts in the field all year, and very different still for SashaShowDog, who is exposed to 1000s of dogs. It's about time!
 
#22 ·
My vet won't skip the first booster after the puppy series, ever. So they get the puppy series, then one full set roughly a year later, and then go to the 3 year shots. He typically will give the distemper/parvo at 2 years instead of 3 on the first go around, to get the shots given different years so not everything is given all at once.
I really wouldn't be worried about parvo from dogs just walking thru your yard, or places where your dogs have casual contact with other dogs. But dogs who show in any dog sport are exposed to LOTS of other dogs, each of whom has been exposed to LOTS of other dogs, so their risk is much higher.
I've had 2 customers here at the pet hotel lose dogs to lepto. It's a horrid disease.
Neither felt they lived in a high risk area; both lived in suburban subdivisions. Very sad.
 
#24 ·
My vet won't skip the first booster after the puppy series, ever. So they get the puppy series, then one full set roughly a year later, and then go to the 3 year shots.
Dr. Ron Schultz is one of the vets who have data showing that after the initial round of puppy vaccines, many dogs will have immunity for life from distemper, parvovirus 2 and adenovirus.

Along with a titer for Mira I was pretty comfortable skipping her booster (my vet agreed). I would not recommended skipping a one year booster without a titer and consulting with a vet!
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top