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Discussion Starter #1
We've now had our new pup a month now and want to report we have a beautiful & healthy english cream golden with a very white coat and even temperment. We feel the breeder is honest and caring and although I understand his concerns with owners who bypass their contractual terms and further breed their pup, I believe there's an element of trust one gains when speaking with John and getting comfortable with him and his integrity. His home is well kept and his dogs are in a safe, clean environment.

I strongly feel this market to be a competitive one and found it easy to find postings reflecting caution and reservation when considering Starr Goldens. If one decides to take a "leap of faith" as we had done, I wanted to provide you with this post and wish you the same success as we had received. We truly have a beautiful dog.........
 

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Kate
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I think you made your personal decision to go with that breeder regardless of any issues that have been brought up about the kennel and now it's on to the real business of raising your puppy and surviving that first year.

I made a similar iffy choice when I got my very golden (we were hoping more for a reddish gold guy, but that may yet happen since goldens coats darken over the years) golden retriever. I don't regret it but don't necessarily advertise for the kennel because I do think there are better and more responsible breeders here in Michigan.

If you are a newbie at this or it's been a while since your last puppy, I think there are a lot of people who can be helpful with whatever issues and questions that come up. The first two years are the toughest. Good luck.
 

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I am always curious about people who make good connections across the pond. Are the puppy's parents from England or did you fly to London and back with the pup? I imported a puppy from Canada, and it was challenging in terms of paperwork & two kennel clubs. What was the paperwork like getting an English puppy through customs?
 
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English cream :uhoh::uhoh: .... is there such a beast??????
 

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In England, and it goes in your coffee!
 

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When someone says "English cream" to me, it would IMMEDIATELY put up the red flags. Oh well, it takes all kinds!;)
 

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I don't care about the previous controversy on this... I adopt rescues because I love goldens no matter where they came from and even top bred goldens (like my Angelina) end up in rescues, so there!

What I am highly disappointed about is you did not post any pictures!!! :mad:

Can we have some pictures please??? :):):p:

And I am so happy your golden is doing well and a big part of your family!
 

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They get it
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I am so glad you found a puppy that fits your lifestyle. Here's hoping your pup has a long and healthy life. Would love to see pictures.

I also hope you were able to get copies of all clearances for your pups parents and verify that all five generations have/had them completed as well (hips, elbows, CERF, heart).

As we all learn in time, cream is not a recognized color with the AKC. And if your dog is indeed from across the pond, then yes, it is English. If not, it is an English type/style, which do tend to be lighter in color, though not cream. Good luck with your pup, and again, please post pictures.
 

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Shoregold
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There is no such thing as English Creams. There are Goldens from England but this does not make them a special breed. There are very few breeders that actually have picked out their pup in England. A large headed blond dog is not an English Cream. It is just not right to market it more then what they are, a light colored golden retriever. I feel bad for those who can reason in their head that this right and would spend more. I also think those who take advantage of the buyer are no more then con-artist
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I have quickly realized the passion and (strong) opinions which this forum's membership provides. I can also see the value and wealth of experience one can access by educated members towards this beautiful breed. What I do NOT care for are those who feel it important to make anyone wishing to purchase a "white" golden feel slighted for doing so. And posting a photo of a can of coffee creamer only suggests an insult to anyone wanting this specific-colored pup if they, God forbid, describe the color as I had done. Mine is pure white, not a beige or cream color and this will not change with age (as I'd been introduced to both parents). Like it or not, this is how they seem to be growingly recognized (as we had learned when investigating via the Net).

Using the term "English Cream" was clearly a mistake on my part and I regret using it since it allowed subsequent postings to completely sidetrack my REASON for posting. Personally, I could care less what they are officially called with AKC registrations. I wanted simply, to provide my (positive) experience with this particular breeder - it was not to either promote his business nor try to convince others to purchase a pup from him.

I will consider this my last post to this forum since a few (not all) have left me regretting my initial contribution and concluding it was of little value anyway based on the subsequent unsolicited "opinions"…....


Life is too short not to enjoy the decisions we make (financial or otherwise) and I will not entertain any efforts to make me feel I made a poor decision with my purchase (albeit intentional or by implication). I do thank those who responded with respect and encouragement and wish you and your pets continued happiness.
 

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I never waiver from my recommendation that any pup you buy should have parents with OFA hip and elbow clearance at 24 months. The heart clearance is done from at least 12 months by a cardiologist. And the eyes are done annually, by an ophthalmologist... if you have all of that plus titles in the parents and the requisite 5 plus generations of clearances, I say go for it.
 

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There is a lot of passion on this forum..but I feel you are a tad defensive.... I have purchased dogs and kept dogs I have bred. I can always learn from someone else with experience....
 
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I'm not trying to be offensive, but I guess I don't understand how people can assert that they own a golden retriever when the dog is... white. Like, the name "golden retriever" in itself implies that the dog is SOME shade of gold. A white dog is... well, a white retriever. I'm NOT saying that white retrievers aren't beautiful, but in my mind, they are not golden retrievers.
 

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I do agree that some posts were more mocking than is really helpful here.

At the same time, you have to understand how frustrating it is for members who work so hard to make sure that people don't purchase from breeders who haven't taken every possible step to ensure a pup's lifelong health and temperament. When a member goes ahead and purchases from a breeder who seems to leaving information off their site in order make it more difficult to look up clearances, it's hard for people to express their frustration positively.

That's why you're getting so many questions about clearances. Do your pup's parents have the four clearances outlined in the GRCA's code of ethics? Or did the breeder convince you that they weren't necessary?

And the standard is important. A truly white dog is outside both American and English standards. So if a dog is white, he's not bred to either standard. And the standard is important to most breed enthusiasts. It's what defines the Golden and keeps him true to his look and purpose. I think that's where you're getting the mocking of "English Cream." A truly cream colored dog could be inside the English standard. But this breeder is intentionally breeding for a particular color (already a bad idea, since it means more important concerns go down the list) outside the standard (another problem).

I don't say this to excuse any posts that were mocking instead of being productive, but I don't think you're going to find a warm welcome for your breeder here until it becomes clear that all clearances are being done. And even if that's the case, you're going to find little traction on the idea of a white Golden Retriever. Nonetheless, I hope that the people who came across as mocking take a second look and consider whether an apology is in order. It's one thing to make a point about good breeding practices or to assess a breeder. It's another to mock a new member.

All that aside, you own the dog now, and we love dogs. I hope your pup has a long, happy life with you, and I hope you stay on the forum. The common health and behavioral questions will apply no matter the dog's color, and I think you'll find some of the same people who feel strongly about clearances and the standard are the quickest to help when there's a problem or to give useful training suggestions when you have a question. You're probably not going to convince anybody to like your breeder, but I think you'll be pleasantly surprised about how much everybody likes your dog.

I, for example, would love to hear her (his?) name and to see more pictures.
 

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Wow, looking back, most of the posts were quite mild.... what did I miss?
 

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Lets keep this thread civil. Please. I agree that a breeder advertising "Rare English Cremes" is suspicious but there are very good breeders working from English lines and there are great British lines out there that have light coats and also great longevity.

Before I really knew anything about goldens I lost my semi golden Arby to cancer and called a breeder advertising in the paper for goldens. She asked what color I preffered and I answered "Red". She told me I needed to see her pups and I went to visit and met Oakly a Very light golden. He comes from great European lines and trailer trash US lines. I could not be happier with his looks, temperment or health to date.

Now that I am older and wiser I would do more research on a next breeder but I am very happy with the health and temperment of my present goldens.
 
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