Misleading

Sievers Retrievers: The best black labradores, yellow labradores, chocolate labradores and golden retrievers available.

If one did not know better, this would give the impression that Goldendoodles are recognized by the AKC.

 

Funny, I just found this thread and was thinking it was going to be entertaining to see if JDFLICK30 thought he was going to be able to reasonably defend his position (or rather, lack) to either PG or Shalva.

I will never understand :no: why some people will continue to insist that the scientific advances we have available are "not worth the expense." Seems like a no brainer that the investment in the breeding stock could potentially save hundreds of thousands of dollars in avoidable medical treatment and surgeries over the lifespan of all the litters they produce if the testing can show that a particular dog shouldn't be bred.


It just seems to me like many of these people simply don't want to admit that maybe there's a better way and maybe they have something to learn. So tired of people's egos....

And I'm shocked at how much ahead of the game the golden retriever world is with testing in spite of the apalling stories we hear on this forum. After spending months researching for my collie puppy, I'm horrified by the complete lack of concern over clearances and testing that I found with collie breeders. I'd say 95% test for eyes only. Over and over I heard, "No, we don't do hips, collies aren't prone to that." Really???

I'm exhausted by these people.
Sorry, this turned into slight hijacking, I just am truly mystified by dog people who are so short-sighted and ego driven.

 

I just am truly mystified by dog people who are so short-sighted and ego driven.

I think it is more money driven.

 

Yes, at least good golden breeders do the testing for the various health issues. To agree with nolefan, I see a number of elder colllies with front and hindlimb lamenesses, yet they are never radiographed and cleared for breeding purposes. I also see a number of shelties whose forelimbs are deformed by arthritis in elbows and wrists in their elder years. So the moral of the story is to go with breeders who do the testing... and breeders who follow up when puppy owners report things to them.

 

I had the same thought when somebody told me that it's unheard of for collies to have hip or elbow dysplasia and/or it isn't a huge concern in the breed.

The advantage that collies have (I should think) is they are much lighter boned than goldens are. Our collie is a couple inches taller than our golden and he is 20 lbs lighter. And at 58lbs, he is still heavier than a lot of the collies in the ring.

He has excellent hips and elbows... but he has arthritis in his neck that causes pinched nerves. And because he is so sensitive to pain, it does not take much for arthritis to be dehabilitating. So he can go from running like the wind to falling over and screaming from a pinched nerve.

 

Siever's Retrievers sold me a golden retriever with hip dysplasia

In March 2010, we bought a golden retriever puppy from Siever's and she has a very sweet disposition but she has suffered from food allergies and skin allergies from day one. In addition, we just took her in for x-rays because she was limping and we discovered she has hip dysplasia. The limping was from a fall, and we have no evidence that she is having any pain from the hip dysplasia. The problem with hip dysplasia is that when they are older, they are more likely to suffer from arthritis and degenerative joint disease. Before we bought her, we asked if the dogs were tested for heart, eye, and hip problems and they assured us that they tested the parents and did not breed any dogs with those problems. Hip dysplasia is a congenital disease, so obviously, one or both of the parents had the gene for hip dysplasia. I agree that Siever's seems to be a puppy mill because they breed their dogs too often and have way too many puppies at one time. When I called to tell them about the hip dysplasia in the golden retriever they sold me, they never returned my call. When I called them once in the past to ask a question about my other dog (a goldendoodle that was exhibiting some knee problems that eventually disappeared) that I bought from them, it was clear that they don't keep any records on computer, didn't want to go search for the paper records (if they exist at all), and were very defensive and not apologetic at all. I will never go back to Siever's. By the way, we paid $1,200 for our golden retriever puppy in March 2010, so it's not a situation of "you get what you pay for" (as if we got a puppy for a cheap price and so we should not be surprised if there are problems).

 

In March 2010, we bought a golden retriever puppy from Siever's and she has a very sweet disposition but she has suffered from food allergies and skin allergies from day one. In addition, we just took her in for x-rays because she was limping and we discovered she has hip dysplasia. The limping was from a fall, and we have no evidence that she is having any pain from the hip dysplasia. The problem with hip dysplasia is that when they are older, they are more likely to suffer from arthritis and degenerative joint disease. Before we bought her, we asked if the dogs were tested for heart, eye, and hip problems and they assured us that they tested the parents and did not breed any dogs with those problems. Hip dysplasia is a congenital disease, so obviously, one or both of the parents had the gene for hip dysplasia. I agree that Siever's seems to be a puppy mill because they breed their dogs too often and have way too many puppies at one time. When I called to tell them about the hip dysplasia in the golden retriever they sold me, they never returned my call. When I called them once in the past to ask a question about my other dog (a goldendoodle that was exhibiting some knee problems that eventually disappeared) that I bought from them, it was clear that they don't keep any records on computer, didn't want to go search for the paper records (if they exist at all), and were very defensive and not apologetic at all. I will never go back to Siever's. By the way, we paid $1,200 for our golden retriever puppy in March 2010, so it's not a situation of "you get what you pay for" (as if we got a puppy for a cheap price and so we should not be surprised if there are problems).

I'm sorry about the problems you and your pup are having. I hope she does well with her hips and never needs surgical intervention. A lot of dogs do live a normal life with bad hips. Thank you for sharing your experience.

 

My golden retriever was from sievers kennels. My mother was a golden breeder and all 6 of her children owned golden retrievers over the years. On 5/1/2010 a family friend purchased Kayleigh, she named her Sweety, but after 1 day in the park, this 50 plus year old man yelling “come here Sweety”, well as you can imagine, it didn’t look very good. Anyhow, this family friend, gifted Kayleigh to me. Kayleigh was the finest looking golden, and the smartest golden I ever laid eyes on. She had the best disposition that you could ever wish for. She gave my wife and I over 12 years of nothing but great joy I know Sievers gives warranties, 30 month I believe on the dogs hips. I lived in Missouri at the time, but now I’m in Florida. I’m contemplating driving back to purchase another female golden. I just don’t believe everyone bashing them. It breaks my heart. Everyone just complains, complains and complains nowadays, a world of complainers we live in. Thank you for adding to your comment, your veterinarians diagnosis. I hope you have years of joy with your dog like we did with our girl Kayleigh. My wife and I are saddened greatly. For we lost our girl 9/7/24.

 

Andrea, Thank you for sharing your experience here so that others may see it if they are searching for information on the internet.

 

There are 2 Sievers..both brothers breed, one is Sievers Kennels and the other is Sievers Retriever. Both are nightmares, but Sievers Kennels is worse.

 

This is so sad to read. All these poor dogs with health problems and all these poor people who are having to deal with this. Its so sad, I want to cry.

 

Just received confirmation from the OFA (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals) that our 2 and a half year old golden retriever that we bought from Siever's Retrievers has mild hip dysplasia. Be warned! Not sure how this could have been avoided, but there are several things about Siever's that bother me, such as the fact that they let us bring home our puppy at 7 weeks of age (I thought the earliest that was allowed was 8 weeks), they don't seem to keep track of documents concerning dogs they have sold, and they have a lot of puppies for sale at any one time. Also, they claim that they don't need to screen the dogs' eyes because "their vet told them it's a waste of money because all their dogs are fine." Will definitely go elsewhere in the future and will not recommend Siever's Retrievers. In the meantime, our dog faces a future of pain from hip dysplasia because of this irresponsible breeder.

 

Andrea, please get your dog to an ACVO veterinary ophthalmologist and get a CERF exam. Given that these people are so grossly negiligent as far as their breeding practices, the chances of there being hereditary eye issues are greatly increased. It is recommended that Goldens have CERF exams ANNUALLY, and not just breeding animals. Pigmentary uveitis is a very painful and potentially blinding (as in removal of the eye) disease. Early diagnosis (hence yearly exams) can save the dog's sight, and prevent painful suffering.

 

In some states it is unlawful to sell a pup until they are 8 weeks old (i.e. Maine), but that is not a hard and fast rule in every state --7 weeks is still acceptable in many. I recently bought home a 7 week old from Canada. In all honesty she is no more mouthy then other 8 week old pups Ive had. However, I am glad that she has the advantage of having 3 other dogs that have continued her bite inhibition lessons.

 

Just confirmed this week that my golden retriever that I bought from Sievers Retrievers 2 and a half years ago does have mild hip dysplasia. The OFA sent me its report, stating that she's a 2 on a scale of 1 to 4, which is considered "mild hip dysplasia." I called Sievers and they are going to refund our purchase price.

I have heard of other breeders who won't refund your money unless you agree to give your dog back to them, so Sievers is being generous, compared to other breeders. It seems like a technique used by some breeders to make them look good because they know no one will ever give up their dog.

As a result of the research I've done, it sounds like you have a very good chance of getting a golden retriever who has hip dysplasia, no matter who you purchase it from. However, I still believe that Sievers should do more to prevent this from happening in the future, such as: they should have an actual veterinary ophthalmologist examine their dogs' eyes (they don't currently check the dogs' eyes because their vet told them it's a waste of money to do so because "all their dogs' eyes are fine"), they should keep better records (I don't think they have anything on computer and seem confused when you call and ask questions), and they should offer proof of clearances (eyes, hips, elbows, heart) and more information about the dogs' parents so potential buyers can research the line and make an informed choice.

I understand that no breeder can guarantee that a golden retriever won't have hip dysplasia or any other problem, but I fear that Sievers is going to keep breeding the mother or father (they couldn't tell me for sure which one they still have and which one has been "retired") even though they know it has at least one puppy with mild hip dysplasia. I have heard that it's common practice for breeders to breed two dogs even if one has been rated "Fair" by the OFA, but I just can't imagine that a good breeder would continue to breed a dog when they have been notified of a puppy that has been rated by the OFA to have "mild hip dysplasia."

 

Just confirmed this week that my golden retriever that I bought from Sievers Retrievers 2 and a half years ago does have mild hip dysplasia. The OFA sent me its report, stating that she's a 2 on a scale of 1 to 4, which is considered "mild hip dysplasia." I called Sievers and they are going to refund our purchase price.

I have heard of other breeders who won't refund your money unless you agree to give your dog back to them, so Sievers is being generous, compared to other breeders. It seems like a technique used by some breeders to make them look good because they know no one will ever give up their dog.

As a result of the research I've done, it sounds like you have a very good chance of getting a golden retriever who has hip dysplasia, no matter who you purchase it from. However, I still believe that Sievers should do more to prevent this from happening in the future, such as: they should have an actual veterinary ophthalmologist examine their dogs' eyes (they don't currently check the dogs' eyes because their vet told them it's a waste of money to do so because "all their dogs' eyes are fine"), they should keep better records (I don't think they have anything on computer and seem confused when you call and ask questions), and they should offer proof of clearances (eyes, hips, elbows, heart) and more information about the dogs' parents so potential buyers can research the line and make an informed choice.

I understand that no breeder can guarantee that a golden retriever won't have hip dysplasia or any other problem, but I fear that Sievers is going to keep breeding the mother or father (they couldn't tell me for sure which one they still have and which one has been "retired") even though they know it has at least one puppy with mild hip dysplasia. I have heard that it's common practice for breeders to breed two dogs even if one has been rated "Fair" by the OFA, but I just can't imagine that a good breeder would continue to breed a dog when they have been notified of a puppy that has been rated by the OFA to have "mild hip dysplasia."

You have a far greater chance of getting a Golden with HD if there is no history of clearances at least 3-5 generations back. Breeding cleared animals (with a solid ancestral history in a vertical pedigree of cleared relatives) GREATLY decreases the risk of producing dogs with HD/ED, cardiac and eye problem. And a "Fair" is passing. KNOWING what is in the vertical pedigree helps a knowledgeable, ethical breeder determine the best way to breed a dog with a "Fair" rating. If that "Fair" dog had siblings that were dysplastic, I would not breed it. If she had siblings that were Excellent, then, yes.)
This is why it is SO important for buyers to SEE CLEARANCE DOCUMENTATION before considering a purchase.

 

I have a golden from Sievers. There are two breeders in Meppen, IL they are brothers and each have a kennel. Sievers Retrivers and Sievers Kennels.

I love my golden. He is regularly complemented by strangers who tell me how handsome he is. I have been stopped and asked where he came from on several occasions.

While I may be biased, he is physically more appealing than nearly every golden I see.

 

Your dog is indeed lovely; however, the things that matter are your dog's health. How old is your Golden? Any health issues yet? Has your Golden been screened for hip dysplasia, elbow dysplasia, heart defects? Has your Golden passed a CERF exam? Any severe allergies, thyroid issues or digestive issues? In my opinion those are the the most important things to know, not where he came from. I had a rescue Golden with some "exotic" looks that stopped a parade, literally, so the MC could talk about him. He was definitely one to get attention from people; however, his health was terrible. I'd rather have a healthy Golden who descended from a line with all the clearances for several generations back than a Golden that looks great on the outside, but is battling all sorts of health issues on the inside. JMO.

 

Count yourself lucky--the Sievers kennels are doing nothing to better the breed and are just churning out pups, you should ask them how many of their pups end up in the local rescues when families can't deal with the health issues.

 

Sievers Retrievers

We are Sievers Retrievers, we do a lot of preliminary's and also OFA certifications...but this is 35 years of back ground on these lines that we have and we can go back all of that way and let you know any information on any dog that is in our lines. We have hearts, thyroid, elbows and Hips checked, we have them all listed here and if anyone ever wanted a copy of these we are always willing to email or print them off a copy. We do not post them on the internet because it is very time consuming but we never deny any of our customers from not seeing all of the dogs information, honesty is the best policy. 99% of our dogs have their OFA's done and are listed in the OFA data base for all to view or send us a email or call for more information. As far as the smell goes, we do everything to disinfect our kennels...in the winter time frame it does smell at times because they are in a building that is closed up to keep the puppies warm and dry, the kennel has a heated floor to help with this and keep it dry. When we clean it does make it wet, it will smell and if your not used to it it might make you want to leave...its a kennel, its not going to smell like roses. Golden Retrievers are not meant to be a 106 lbs, on average ours are no more then 90-95lbs. If you have a dog from us that is 106lbs that can be caused by many things...not the proper exercise, feeding off the table, or you may want to go ahead and get the dogs thyroid checked just to be on the safe side. Breeding dogs for 35 years and if we had such bad dogs we wouldn't have people coming back for their 1st, 2nd, and 3rd dog. Yes we might have a issue once in awhile, we can't play god and prevent everything but we do everything that we can to raise health, calm, easy going and non hyper dogs. Yes we may be a bit red neck, live in the country, and we are very darn proud to be down to earth people who stand by our dogs even if its years later. We do not appreciate the slandering remarks on the internet and would prefer for all that do not know us give us a call and come on over for a visit...we would be happy to introduce you to all of our dogs, family and let you see our process. Remember we do have to get checked by the State of Illinois and also AKC once a year, this is a surprise visit and we pass with flying colors every year for the past 35 years.
Thanks
Roger and Michelle Sievers and staff

 

We are Sievers Retrievers, we do a lot of preliminary's and also OFA certifications...but this is 35 years of back ground on these lines that we have and we can go back all of that way and let you know any information on any dog that is in our lines. We have hearts, thyroid, elbows and Hips checked, we have them all listed here and if anyone ever wanted a copy of these we are always willing to email or print them off a copy. We do not post them on the internet because it is very time consuming but we never deny any of our customers from not seeing all of the dogs information, honesty is the best policy. 99% of our dogs have their OFA's done and are listed in the OFA data base for all to view or send us a email or call for more information. As far as the smell goes, we do everything to disinfect our kennels...in the winter time frame it does smell at times because they are in a building that is closed up to keep the puppies warm and dry, the kennel has a heated floor to help with this and keep it dry. When we clean it does make it wet, it will smell and if your not used to it it might make you want to leave...its a kennel, its not going to smell like roses. Golden Retrievers are not meant to be a 106 lbs, on average ours are no more then 90-95lbs. If you have a dog from us that is 106lbs that can be caused by many things...not the proper exercise, feeding off the table, or you may want to go ahead and get the dogs thyroid checked just to be on the safe side. Breeding dogs for 35 years and if we had such bad dogs we wouldn't have people coming back for their 1st, 2nd, and 3rd dog. Yes we might have a issue once in awhile, we can't play god and prevent everything but we do everything that we can to raise health, calm, easy going and non hyper dogs. Yes we may be a bit red neck, live in the country, and we are very darn proud to be down to earth people who stand by our dogs even if its years later. We do not appreciate the slandering remarks on the internet and would prefer for all that do not know us give us a call and come on over for a visit...we would be happy to introduce you to all of our dogs, family and let you see our process. Remember we do have to get checked by the State of Illinois and also AKC once a year, this is a surprise visit and we pass with flying colors every year for the past 35 years.
Thanks
Roger and Michelle Sievers and staff

The internet is a wonderful thing! you revived a very old thread to defend your breeding practices and have provided a wealth of information for potential puppy buyers. An educated buyer is a good thing!!
1) too much of a hassle for you to post clearances on your website - paper copies have been known to be altered.
2) you admit that your dogs are 90-95 lbs and seem to have no issue with that! seems clear that you are not paying attention to the golden retriever standard
3) kennel smell? How many dogs are in your kennel at one time?
4) health issues? can you comment on the issues that people in this thread are discussing? hips, allergies, etc?
5) slandering? i haven't scoured the internet for comments about your kennels but this thread alone raises concerns for me. Are you suggesting that the things people have shared in this thread are untrue?
6) your website states the following: "all of our breeds are free from hereditary problems" and "dogs are thought to be the healthiest and well socialized you will find in the entire midwest region" <--- those are bold statements and I don't see anything to back them up except for the words on your website.
Buyer beware!

 

Looking at the breed standard - golden retrievers are not supposed to be 90+ lbs. That is 20+ pounds over the breed standard. A golden retriever bred to standard should be about 60-75 lbs - with a 5# allowance generally. And females, because they are smaller than males should be lighter than that. I know people whose females generally are between 50-65lbs at a healthy weight.

If you have a dog who is so overweight as to weigh in the 90's - I would suspect a thyroid problem or these dogs are not breed standard size (24" tops for males, females shorter than that). My older boy is 85lbs, and he absolutely is too heavy and needs to lose a good 10+ lbs. The dogs we had who were 90+ lbs, were seniors and usually were not able to get the correct amount of exercise to get that weight off + they were heavy with fatty tumors.

Preliminaries are not clearances.

And breeding a dog prior to full clearances is no-no.

Core clearances should be EYES, Hearts, Elbows, and Hips. Final clearances for elbows and hips. And preferably these should be viewed on OFFA.org. Eyes should be done every year.

There's a lady here in Michigan who has been breeding for about 30+ years and is frequently checked by the State of Michigan and also AKC. But she's seen as a puppy mill by everyone who is trying to get her shut down. So amount of time somebody is breeding + their statements of getting OK's from the state and AKC is meaningless.

And don't forget - see the GRCA.org statement w/regards to intentionally producing mutts (doodles).

*** And somebody just told me that this breeder is even worse than I understood, as they not only are producing all kinds of poodle mixes, but they are deliberately producing lab mixes (goldens X labs). Seriously what the heck is wrong with people. Aren't there enough mixed breeds in animal shelters and rescue groups?! >.<

 

Very interesting thread, commenting to follow.

 

Please don't support these kind of Greeders. Everyone knows you are going to love whatever puppy you get, so support a good breeder who is seriously concerned for the welfare of the Golden Retriever now and in the future, and not just interested in the money they can make off their current SIX?? litters! You'd think with all that cash they could at least finish up the OFA clearances and not continue breeding to dysplastic throwing dogs. But then again, when that bitch comes in heat, all they see is the dollar signs.

 

Wow, just literally puppy farmers. I've never seen anyone have to defend the smell of their kennel, must be something horrible!

 

I'd never read this thread-- but I have to comment on the website sieverskennels.com... think much of yourself lol? WORLD famous for Goldens?
I kinda doubt that = look at their stud dogs- Sievers Kennels - Hunting Dogs & Family Pets, Labradors & Golden Retrievers
Oh my, please learn to stack a dog so they don't look worse than they probably are ....

 

Where did you get your next Golden?