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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #81
Finally a good day for Proof.
First set up was set of singles set up like a double. Proof nailed all his marks.
Then to water. Two long singles. The short bird was pretty long but straight forward, down a steep slope into water, cross a pennisula back into water and out and up the other side and into the trees. He pinned his bird. Second mark was incredibly hard. like crazy hard to me. So I asked if the gun could stand up and then moved up about 50 yards. The entry was already long but the concepts and keeping the line to the bird was so hard. I just wanted to make sure proof had a good mark but retrieved it confidently. He lined the bird through all of the land and crazy water channels etc. Even went to the corner of the pond and got his bird which landed on the slope of the bank. He didn't even climb up the bank! And the best part he didn't no go once today! Of course the trainer feels that we can't band aid it but I needed some good runs from Proof today for my own confidence and I think its good for Proof to run clean every once in awhile.
Afterwards we worked on some more tough yard stuff that I need to continue by myself for the next week. Proof did much better with it today and is in great spirits tonight.
I'm glad for a break for awhile until Monday. I'm getting a bit overwhelmed and need to relax for a few days. This field training is NO JOKE. No wonder most people put their dogs with a pro!
 

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If it was easy, they'd all be FCs ... but it's not and they aren't.

Nice work!

FTGoldens
aint that right! and we all know all dogs have issues somewhere. just have to know what they are and how to deal with them on test day!

not to steal MoP thread but i know with my older dog if she looks at a short gun when she comes back to the line she is wanting to go there so you have to line her fat in a trial on the mark you want, to let her know she isn't going to that short bird and has to go long. (unless it is the short bird you want her to go to)
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #84
First off, I'd like to say that all that I write here is the truth. Some days are harder than others. Some days Proof nails every mark and some days he has to be taught how to do them and some days he's just being a dork. Some days I feel on top of the world and some days I feel like we aren't ever going to get this accomplished. I chronicle all my feelings and emotions here so people that might be reading can learn from it and know its not all butterflies and rainbows. Also, to realize that while Proof has talent it isn't enough. He has to work hard all week and learn new concepts. He has to handle pressure and be confident. To say we both have to dig deep is an understatement.

Anyway, today met Ben to get in some work. I was really impressed with the marks. So set up two singles with guns. Long gun was going to the other corner of the pond. Proof hasn't done that before. Gun shooting right to left. There was a point the dog had to swim past on the right and keep going to corner. The entry into water was through lots of patches of cover and angled to the left about 75 yards into water. Bird falling down hill along the crest. About 130 or so yards after exiting the water.
Proof took a line into water towards gun. He did swim to the point. Got out and I said no here no no and small nic, he got into water, swam a bit whistled him and gave him an angle back left as ben said hey hey. He took it beautifully and exiting in that corner. Then carried line but feel to some strips of cover and started towards the gun but took a sharp left in front of gun. Ran around a bit, I think Ben made motion and he got the bird. Reran mark and this time took a better line to the water and swam to that perfect corner, was much wider from gun and got his bird. I think Proof is starting to pick up that he needs to stay in water as far as he can.
Second mark was a easy bird that fell close to the bank but barely clipping corner of the pond. First time he didn't cheat and grabbed his bird. He stayed close to the bank too, he is getting so much better at not running past the mark. He cheated around the gun coming back. Reran it and he came straight back didn't cheat on the way back.

Then ran three blinds that were strips of cover and on the side of a bowl of slopes. Proof did pretty good. He was sucking to the center of the bowl instead of carrying his line but still got his birds. What I'm really impressed about is I am starting to understand the way a dog will carry lines and on the longest blind I didn't stop him as I knew he'd pull back up with the slopes and he did! So glad this stuff is starting to sink in for me so when I'm running him at trials I can anticipate the way a dog runs.

Then we did some more yard stuff, and worked on some OB and let the pups run around afterwards for a bit.
 

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here is the setup Mop and I setup today. i can say it sucks not having a 4wheeler or an ATV. but burning a few calories never hurt anyone. long bird (G1) first then short easy bird (G2) as singles.

Also if anyone wants cheap easy and compact stickmen let me know i have a friend that is starting a side business for dog products. as you can see even in a crappy cell phone pic G1 (that measured 330yards on the range finder) can still be seen.

 

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If you look closely you can see the strips of cover that they mow. Those really mess up the dogs! And that is what we ran the dogs through for blinds.
Roughly, how wide and how long are the strips of cover? I have some really big strips (roughly 120 yards x 30 yards) that I will be reducing to smaller strips and patches, so I'm trying to figure out how big/small to make them and how to shape them (I know that circles and triangles of cover are in my dogs' future!).
FTGoldens
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #88
Hmmm. That field is really huge and the strips of cover wrap around the whole field and they follow the slopes. If you zoom in you will see they are not straight they are rolling strips and are endlessly going. They are about 15 feet mowed between them. Maybe ten, I'm not sure but they are thin, maybe 2 to three feet of cover that makes the strips.
This photo only shows half of of the field. behind us the strips carry on and wrap around a point of the field that is a bowl shape of slopes backing up to another tree line. The strips roll against the bowl making dogs want to square even more.
That field is the field of hell. Lots of work for the dogs to hold their lines! IN fact, that long mark, the way the strips were, it made Belle follow the strips instead of hold her line and proof was also influenced to follow as well. We had a strip of cover going straight to the gun, so the dogs didn't want to hold their angle up to the mark, instead following that cover that led them to back side the gunner.
 

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Roughly, how wide and how long are the strips of cover? I have some really big strips (roughly 120 yards x 30 yards) that I will be reducing to smaller strips and patches, so I'm trying to figure out how big/small to make them and how to shape them (I know that circles and triangles of cover are in my dogs' future!).
FTGoldens
if you look right in front of the line were there is a strip of cover on the left side of the pic and strip of cover on the right side of the pic that is what every row looks like from one end of the field to the other end of the field
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #90 (Edited)
What a wonderful day. Beautiful weather and warm mid afternoon but cool in the morning.

First set up was a delayed triple all left to right throws. So The first long mark, then turn to the right and the go bird is on a mound. Sent Proof and he nailed it, comes back and I tell him easy and in the middle a gunner stands up and throws a bird in the cover. Sent Proof and he nailed it, he might cheat water but in cover he is pretty steady, and then he came back and I told him where's your watch bird and he looked out and I said good and sent him. **** he did so good, he just hauled butt and went a bit wide, thinking he is slightly staying away from the old fall but took a good angle and ran right up to his bird. I was so happy, he had no go'd on something similar last week. Then Went down and did a LONG single. Took a bit to get him to look out because to his right were two guns for a double. So he went but head swung a bit, then I sent him he just lined that bird, came back and had a short memory bird and a long go bird. He took a gorgeous line to the long bird but missed it a few feet and ran long. Hunted a bit in some cover and made his way back down. Never went behind the gun. Then came in to NAIL his short go bird.
So for Proof knowing the consequences a bit better on no go gave him the chance to just not overthink and GO! and when he just went he nailed everything. So little man build up some confidence.

Then Old Proofers ran his first two water blinds. They were crazy for beginners but my trainer likes to see what they can do first and he thought proof could handle it. But both of us were curious to see what little man would do. And Proof did great!! He took off and ran down a hill at an angle and he went int he water! with a dive! And then he started swimming and took my casts in the water and up on land ect. It was great! He did get a little nutty up on the land but got control and finished it. The second one was way over his level but but he took all my handles and never gave up and at the end I let him get off a bit. he did good. Very proud of my proofers.
Went and did more yard work...
First photo his first series the line is the other side of the duck rack so there was a lot of angle on the marks except for the long bird. These are his blinds
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #91 (Edited)
Wow!!! Another great day for Proofers. Weather was beautiful after the fog finally lifted....

First set up was a fairly hard, tight double with converging marks. The short bird to the right and the long memory bird to the left. The short go bird was fairly straight forward. Landing behind a hay bale etc and some cover. standard stuff. To the memory bird there was a mound and some slopes pushing the dog to back side the gun. Proof came up and he is revving to go. All the yard work has him all go go go and he wasn't steady. So had to get some sits in at the line. Then he took off got his bird fine, comes back and leaves for go hill but totally goes around the mound and fell to the suction. Gets behind the gun, sit...no no here here nic nic brought him in had him get arm from BB and then he took off and lined his duck. Came back and ran a blind directly to the left of the old fall. Proof did good, only had one cast off the suction of the long mark. then took off and then over ran my cast into cover but as I brought him out he got it.

Second set up was a double again, long bird into corner bank of pond, short go bird to the left of it with the bird just falling on land in cover. Proof ran up through the cover but missed it ran past flipped and got his bird, long bird was a hard long angle into and proof did good then got to the other side but that little stinker knew to stay in the water and swam up until he got just past the point he needed to be past to get away with it....the trainer laughs that I'm gonna catch him one of these days! And sure enough he passed the duck down on the water's edge because he got out too early. So he ran up but then came back down and grabbed it. Good boy, bud, you're start getting it.
Then ran two bucket blinds, one of which was in the shade when Proof came up so he couldn't see it. It was so far, maybe 350 yards or more. But it went over a steep creek. Proof saw his first one but I don't think he realized that is the blind so he took off and veered left. Cast him and the ran to the bucket. Second one he couldn't see it. He ran down but got down in the ditch and came up down the shore then was not sure to go across. i moved closer but finally he took a back and got across. not great but let him roll since he got over the ditch. Then at that moment I was going to stop him he saw the bucket and figured it out ran to it and finished great with lots of momentum! good stuff!!
Did some more yard work and came home. Tomorrow its supposed to rain so I'm going to work on OB at home, his sits and heels have gotten a little sloppy....I want to use some happy treats for that.
 

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Thanks for sharing Shelby.
Your notes/training journal could be deemed a learning tool for folks who want to know what it takes to train a high rolling field trial dog.
FTGoldens
i never knew how hard it would be to run with the "big dogs" until i went and day trained with the young dog trainer and really ran his setups and how he corrects dogs. it is amazing at how fast these high rolling dogs progress and he isnt prepping this dogs for derbies and Qs he is preparing them for All Age work from the day they arrive at the kennel.

MoP did a hell of a job doing it by herself with wingers and some tshirts on a blind pole. but now that she has started with a young dog trainer holy cow at what she and Proof can do is unreal. used to be i would push her now she has a darn bull dozier and shoving me to do things with my young dog i didnt think i could do.

MOP you rock HOMIE!!!!
 

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MoP is a naturally gifted trainer and is now partnered with a naturally gifted dog. They're gonna be dangerous!! Hopefully she blows through QAA and a mere mortal like me won't have to compete against her :)
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #96
aww thanks you guys. Im very lucky that I had so many of you supporting me and pushing me. I have a few people that I don't see in person but they spend countless time on the Internet mentoring me as well. And now, I don't know how I got so very lucky, have this dog with these amazing mentors helping me. It is more than a novice like me could ever dream to have with her first dog. Proof has really opened up the doors for me. It is so exciting. And I love that my trainer, who is an amazing young dog trainer, always treats proof like a dog not like a "golden." He thinks of Proof as a great DOG, not golden. It is so exciting and I've learned so much from him and from another great that mentors me as well. And it is hard and I'm experiencing all these struggles for the first time while they tell me that is how all dogs are which really encourages me. They also take the time to explain to me what I'm trying to teach them and why its important. Its very cool! I don't take it for granted at all!!
 

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aww thanks you guys. Im very lucky that I had so many of you supporting me and pushing me. I have a few people that I don't see in person but they spend countless time on the Internet mentoring me as well. And now, I don't know how I got so very lucky, have this dog with these amazing mentors helping me. It is more than a novice like me could ever dream to have with her first dog. Proof has really opened up the doors for me. It is so exciting. And I love that my trainer, who is an amazing young dog trainer, always treats proof like a dog not like a "golden." He thinks of Proof as a great DOG, not golden. It is so exciting and I've learned so much from him and from another great that mentors me as well. And it is hard and I'm experiencing all these struggles for the first time while they tell me that is how all dogs are which really encourages me. They also take the time to explain to me what I'm trying to teach them and why its important. Its very cool! I don't take it for granted at all!!
and if you do im taking back the yeti cup and giving to J! HAHAHA
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #98
So today was cold, brrr with a very strong wind.

Pulled up and ran Proof on a hard set of singles. Long gun was super far out and in a valley with hay bales all around throwing behind a bush running past a short gun that is up on a hill. Almost all the dogs including proof ran towards the fall and then at the crevice of these slopes squared up to the short gun fall. no here, nic, here, nic and then rerun it. I think Proof got it on the second run, but I can't remember for sure, so many dogs I forget they almost all do the same things. Run Proof on the short gun and he lined it no issues.
Second was a set of three blinds. Middle first, then right and then go to the long blind on the right. That was meant to be a key hole through hay bales. Well first blind proof ran out and sort of popped half way at the bottom of a valley but I said back and he kept running. Sat him cast him angle right and he got his blind with that cast. Second pulled a perfect line all the way up to the tree line and then started veering off so I sat him. he scalloped back to where he wanted and sat him again , here here, sat him and cast him over and he got his blind. Third long one I moved up but not close enough so he darted over to the right of the hay bale. At that point I wanted to keep up his momentum. So I ignored the key hole part and just gave him a long left cast to push him up the hill and he took it for a long time. Sat him gave him another long right cast and he took that to right where he was supposed to bu then he fell to some hay bales and sniffed. Sat him gave him a back he turned the wrong way went around the hay bales and then I sat him. It took two more casts and he got his blind.
Third set up was a hip pocket that was pretty tight actually. So had hard time getting Proof off of the short bird but did, he watched and then moved over did short bird and he got his go bird. Came back watched a silent throw of the bird and then went ran up got his bird.
So pretty nice little day though it was cold!
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #99
Today I trained with Ben and just did concepts for for Bodey but they were good for the other dogs as well. Wanted to work the man on his BIRTHDAY! My proofers is one year old today!
Beautiful weather, chilly with some wind but nothing like it was yesterday.

So first set up was a hip pocket type thing but we only had one of us to throw so we compromised. The marks were short, around 100 yards but they were tight and strategically placed with the long bird tight to the back of the short gun.

So I got up to the line and had proof look long, so practiced that with that short gun in his face. Then I had Ben throw the long bird. Proof turned behind him and we ran a very easy blind that was put behind a thicker cover patch. Came back and then Ben was at the short gun so easy mark, Proof got that came back and where is you watch bird, looked long and then I sent him. He took the side of the hay bale I wish he had't but hugged it and ran right to the bird.
Turned around and did a similar set up with just singles, short gun first. Shorter marks again. He did great.
Then moved to some bucket blinds. Worked up close to a set of trees for him to go through. Moved back and reran it and did that a couple times until Proof was going and coming through the trees. Then turned and ran another bucket blind with the trees much closer to the blind this time, and the line far to see if the concept was understood. Proof went through them, so yay.
Then went down and reran the super long water blind that he did last week but put a bucket up for it. I love how he dives in the water even on a blind! This time he swam and took two casts in the bigger water, swam to the dike, got out and saw the bucket and jumped in and didn't cheat the water!! Yay!
 

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aka Shelby
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Discussion Starter #100 (Edited)
Today Proofers did pretty good. It was a coldish day and mostly cloudy.
First set up was a torturous gun down slopes with mowed strips also pushing them down. Gunner on the upward slope throwing right to left. a big flyer station up to the left throwing right to left and another bird way in the middle like a tight hip pocket also throwing right to left.
We were running the dogs all differently based on head swinging or whatnot on the far right hard gun. Proof fell into the head swinging category. So he watched the bird go down but immediately turned his head and then wouldn't come back to here off that flyer station. So he got sent took off then switched to the flyer area. Got a pretty big correction on that one. Come back in, watched the whole bird go off again and was sent. Took a very similar line as the rest of the dogs and let himself backside the gun. Luckily, though, quickly recovered and grabbed his bird. didn't Correct for the back siding this time due to his prior correction and he did pretty good pulling back around. Then came back the flyer. He got one that was flapping, he hammered it. Last was the long middle bird. It was a hard one as the dog had to really dig to hold his angled line up that slope while losing sight of the gun. Proof nailed it! Yay, he took a great line and stayed close to the flyer station. I was very pleased. The pro thinks he is only half way trained as he still turned his head and thought about it. He said if he had flared it he would have known not to go near the station. But to me they are the same thing. One day is thinking about it and reacts to flaring it, the other thinks about it and turns his head towards the gun but never veers off line. I'm not expert so I'm sure there is an explanation for this.
Second set up was a blind that was running behind the gun going up several humps uphill. Proof actually "lined it" and when I say lined it he never got a whistle because his line kept pushing up and though not straight and then ended up bananaing up from the hill and going straight to the blind. Always nice to keep that momentum going even it it's not a straight line. Second was the gun throwing the bird which landed downhill in a deep strip of cover. Boy if the dog didn't push up and didn't want to get in cover he had a big big hunt. Proof did go straight to the fall which was in the deep cover. He seems to love to hunt cover so he had a super tight hunt and grabbed his bird. I was very happy about that. Then he ran a super super long blind past the the fall to the left. Proof got past that fine and did pretty good but after about 300 yards which also happened to be going uphill now he started breaking down a bit. After a lot of whistles and me moving up about 100 yards he got his blind.
He did really great. It seems like now that we haven't had any no go's lately we've been able to get back to learning. Things are starting to click in his head. I'm very proud of how hard he works and the effort he always gives. He seems like the kind of dog that enjoys the game so much he's willing to learn the rules. He is a great little dog.
 

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