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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello, I just joined the forum in hoping I can get some advice on what has been consuming my mind for the past few days.
few days ago we went to see the last puppy of a litter. He was turning 7 weeks old the following day.He was the cutest ever but he was crying and shaking like shivering about 90% of the time. He also hid underneath a chair on the front porch of the seller. It was a farm and they looked like a nice family. They are obviously not registered breeders but the price for the puppy is actually the same as we would have paid at one of the well known breeders.The waiting list for a puppy at the breeder was over a years wait and I really wanted to get a puppy and have himjoin our family right away especially to be my 5 year old’s new best friend since he has been negatively affected by COVID and our isolation etc.
I did ask the owner if he was maybe cold since it was a cold day but she said that no he wouldn’t be cold in this weather. So when I held the puppy and hugged him he calmed down but then he would go back to this shivering.
Anywaays we were so excited to have him and my son got so attached to him and we paid a non refundable deposit. We are to go get him next week. I have been thinking about this no. Stop and wondering if there is something more than just him being scared from meeting new people and that he’s just so young. Can anyone tell me if this shaking is ok or not? I booked a vet appointment for the puppy the day after we bring him home. What if the vet says there is something wrong? He looked otherwise healthy but he wasn’t playful.
plz help
 

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If he’s that scared to meet new people and is not playful, it seems like he hasn’t had a good foundation of socialization. When you say he’s the last puppy, you mean the other ones have already gone to their new homes? That’s too early, they shouldn’t leave mom and littermates until 8 weeks. And you mention it’s a farm. All these add up to me that these people are just raising puppies in a barn or kennels and not giving them much needed socialization. All bad signs here. I would definitely not get this puppy, the poor socialization can definitely affect bonding and training, plus you’ve said nothing about health clearances of the parents dogs (did they even let you meet the mother?) so the likelihood of him developing joint problems or having a heart condition is a total question mark. In addition, you said the price is similar to well known breeders, so it seems like this breeder has just taken advantage of higher than usual demand to up their prices.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The rest of the litter haven’t gone to their new homes yet but other people have already picked them to take home next week.
We didn’t get to see them though and I don’t know what got over us we didn’t ask mannnnny important questions! I feel so angry at myself and my husband because there are so many things we should have asked about but didn’t cz puppy was so adorable and I saw how our son was happy.
Ok so the add said we can see both parents ( obviously we didn’t ask to)
They are in a barn not in their home ( I didn’t think that was a bad thing at the tome but I should have atleast asked to see it)
I guess it’s better to lose the deposit than bring him home and discover he has behavioural or health issues. I don’t want to get attached to him and have my son attached and then find we have a problem. This past year has been beyond stressful for all of us as a family and I don’t think I can handle any more worrying about a new family member.

:(
If he’s that scared to meet new people and is not playful, it seems like he hasn’t had a good foundation of socialization. When you say he’s the last puppy, you mean the other ones have already gone to their new homes? That’s too early, they shouldn’t leave mom and littermates until 8 weeks. And you mention it’s a farm. All these add up to me that these people are just raising puppies in a barn or kennels and not giving them much needed socialization. All bad signs here. I would definitely not get this puppy, the poor socialization can definitely affect bonding and training, plus you’ve said nothing about health clearances of the parents dogs (did they even let you meet the mother?) so the likelihood of him developing joint problems or having a heart condition is a total question mark. In addition, you said the price is similar to well known breeders, so it seems like this breeder has just taken advantage of higher than usual demand to up their prices.
 

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I really want to say this nicely, but I’m not sure it’s going to sound like that no matter what. Please do not get this puppy. It sounds like once the puppy high wore off and you could see clearly again that deep down, you know this isn’t a good puppy to get. You are likely to be in a world of heartbreak. Even raised in a barn, Goldens generally are not terrified of new people. If these people are charging the same as good breeders, then they are ripping you off.
Think about it like this too: if all of the good breeders don’t have puppies available, then why do these people have puppies available?

Also, reputable breeders generally don’t let people pick their own puppies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Makes sense :(
So I am thinking of calling her and asking to see the puppy another time. And this time I’ll ask to see the mom, the dad and the barn and the rest of his litter. It’s a sunny much warmer day today so maybe he will be more comfortable playing a bit and that way I’ll see how he responds to us. I would have preferred to go on my own to see him but will have to take my son as well but this tome I’ll be more objective about.
If I’m still uncomfortable then I’ll just let her know that we will not be able to take him. If I lose the deposit which most probably will be the case i guess it’s better than losing the whole amount and having my son and all of us really heartbroken over an illness or other behaviour problems.
 

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Children are amazingly resilient and logical, if your son understands you have some questions about how the dogs are kept and what problems may stem from that, and that's why the second visit, it will be much easier to make the right decision.
Good luck.
 

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First of all, you need to see this puppy within the context of the litter. Watch the puppy interact and play with his littermates. It may tell a different story, or it may tell the same story.

If it's the same, then you have to understand that you will be taking home an unsocialized, fearful puppy. That usually goes one of two directions as the puppy ages.

First direction is that with love, socialization and confidence-building exercises in the first six weeks you have him, he could begin to flourish. He may always be a bit timid and insecure ("soft"), but he would grow into a loving "velcro" dog. That's an overall good outcome, that can be reached with lots of good, confidence building exercises early on.

The second direction is that he could remain fearful, and develop into a fear-biter, where whatever he's afraid of, he bites, be it other dogs, or you or your son, or visitors to the property. That's obviously a bad outcome. And biters never get better, they only get worse over time. Some intense and expensive training can improve fear biters, but they are never 100% trustworthy IMHO.

I've taken two dogs like that, and both ended up with the first outcome. But I think that is due to the fact that I have several other dogs who help socialize any new addition, and I'm a breeder who rears confident, courageous puppies, so I know what to do to get them there. Getting this puppy sounds like it could be a project. But puppies are incredibly malleable, especially the earlier you get them, and a ton of love and correct socialization can go a long way.
 

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I wish you luck. A 7 week old Golden puppy should be interested in people and exploring and loving life. Because puppies grow at an incredibly high rate of speed, every single day of life matters for them. Even one day locked away in a barn away from humans is a huge loss of the neurological stimulation they need to adapt well to going home with you on take home day.

If you think your son will be sad about not taking this puppy home next week, consider just how heartwrenching it will be for him if this puppy grows up to be a dog who is fearful and distrusting of people to the point he isn't safe to be in your home. The majority of dog bites aren't aggression, they're out of fear and anxiety. If you're a dog lover, there is no grief as horrible as realizing you have a dearly loved dog who isn't safe around children in your family or their friends who visit.

I urge you to ask the owners of the litter for health clearances on Hips, Heart, Eyes and Elbows for the parents of the litter. Those are the bare minimum health clearances for breeding. I guarantee they won't be able to produce proof and you will have your excuse for walking away.
 

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You probably know that the whole 'raised in a barn' scenario is a bad one, and not a good one for a Golden puppy. If this were a breed inclined to livestock guarding, independence, and low temperatures, like a Great Pyr for example, you would be more likely to find this litter turn out like they are supposed to turn out. Golden puppies NEED exposure to people, kitchen sounds, vacuums, in and out and they need to associate humans with all things good. Being raised in a barn is also more likely to end up a potty training problem imo. No one mops a barn floor.
Dana's two outcomes are really the only two there are.
 

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I agree with what everyone is saying. I know getting a puppy is something people want to do right away and they don't want to wait for. But sometimes the wait is what makes the puppy even better. I understand how bad COVID affects everyone, but a fearful puppy is just going to add on to the stress. I highly suggest getting on a waitlist with a responsible breeder. I know this can be hard to hear, but think about the puppy that will be there after all the waiting. I am on a waitlist for a year and even though the wait has been hard for me. It gives me something to look forward to and prepare for. Best of luck with your puppy! :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I keep looking at his photos on my phone and I feel bad for thinking of not getting him.. we are a really loving family and will take good care of him buttttt then again I can’t take on any more worrying.
 

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I keep looking at his photos on my phone and I feel bad for thinking of not getting him.. we are a really loving family and will take good care of him buttttt then again I can’t take on any more worrying.
You definitely don't buy a puppy from someone who doesn't have the 4 core clearances and DNA testing done, and not from someone who leaves them in a barn, or a puppy who seems sickly in anyway. There have been too many people this year who want a puppy and want it NOW. This creates a ton of problems for everyone. Get in line on a waitlist with a good, reputable breeder and wait for your turn to come. 6 months isn't that long, and even if it takes a little longer you're going to have the next 10 to 15 years to spend with that puppy, don't make those years full of emotional and financial strain and regret by buying an unethically bred puppy that ends up with physical and emotional issues. There are so many people on FB who love their new GR but the dog is constantly itchy, sickly, has the runs, has behavioral issues, covered in hot spots, diagnosed with HD or ED and has cost them thousands in vet visits or surgery. You don't want to go down that road.
 

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I'm in Ontario, and can't think of any even half way decent breeder that would have puppies available at the movement. Where did you find out about this "breeder"? from Kijiji? In Ontario we have the Amish now breeding puppies like livestock...living and being raised in barns. There is much more money to be made in selling puppies now...then raising beef, or pigs, etc. This is a quick moneymaker for the Amish....and they see no problems raising dogs like livestock in their barns. They often advertise on Kijiji. I would pass....these are just puppy mills....ask to see inside of the barn where the pup has been raised...:rolleyes:
 

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What did you decide?
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
He was so energetic , happy,running around and I am so surprised it looked like he actually remembered us! He came running to us when she put him on the grass and actually went straight to my 5 year old There was non of that crying and shivering it’s like he was another puppy. I’m so glad we decided to go and see him again. We will go take him home next week. Thank you all for your advice I really appreciate it. I realise my decision may not be the wisest but I know that we will love him and he will love us and hopefully everything goes well.
 

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He was so energetic , happy,running around and I am so surprised it looked like he actually remembered us! He came running to us when she put him on the grass and actually went straight to my 5 year old There was non of that crying and shivering it’s like he was another puppy. I’m so glad we decided to go and see him again. We will go take him home next week. Thank you all for your advice I really appreciate it. I realise my decision may not be the wisest but I know that we will love him and he will love us and hopefully everything goes well.
Please consider pet insurance right away since he comes from tenuous circumstances.
 

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Good breeders don't let people pick their puppies. I didn't know which puppy I was getting until the week before we got her. Also, she had zero problem adjusting to our home, as in her breeders house, she was raised in the living room, was around every other animal in the house from day one. I'm glad he seemed happier when you visited the second time, but as the previous poster said, sign him up for pet insurance ASAP, as you have no idea what health problems you're going to deal with down the road since you have no health clearances on the parents or other dogs.
 
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