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Discussion Starter #1
Hello,

I have a 9 year old Golden that I purchased from Signature Gold Goldens in Southern Maine in February of 2008. He was born in October of 2007. Mom was Keiko and Dad was Casanova (from Nautilus kennel). I'm trying to find owners of dogs from the same litter or same parents to find out if any of them experienced health problems. Sampson came with a health guarantee and has had more health problems than either of my previous Goldens. He was diagnosed with hip dysplasia at 9 months and he now has dilated cardiomyopathy, protein-losing nephropathy, liver disease, and hypothyroidism. Can anyone give me tips for finding Sampson's siblings?

Sampson and I thank you!
 

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the party's crashing us
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I looked in K9data and found no litters sired by Casanova (Nautilus Purple Passion) born in October of 2007. I also searched for dogs named Keiko since that is rather unusual and about half a dozen dogs showed up, none of them seem logical matches for the time frame (or, they were males). So k9data appears to be a dead end from the information you've given.
Did you ever have Sampson registered with the AKC? It is easy to look up any other registered littermates if you have his AKC number, in AKC's online database.
 

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Puddles
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I found a Facebook page for signature gold goldens... dated 10/14/2016 with a picture of a pup named KADA "Keiko's Great Grand"
Guessing there is a relationship somewhere. I don't do Facebook so information is limited but thought you might want to explore.
Guess you could post that you are looking for litter mates but leave out the reason to get a better chance of responses.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
We never registered Sampson. I found the same information that you found on k9data. I'm going to keep digging. I appreciate your response!
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Yes, she has a website, but I doubt I'd get any response if I asked her directly. I took her to court over the hip issue when Sampson was a year old (I lost) so she's not my biggest fan. I believe Kada is the daughter of one of Sampson's littermates that the breeder kept, so she is Keiko's grand-daughter. Keiko's hip status was never posted on the OFA website so, that raised a red flag for me early on. I was able to find Casanova's hip status so I knew his hips were good. Based on the breeder's facebook page, it appears that both Keiko and the sibling from Sampson's litter that she kept (Koda) passed away last October. If there are health issues associated with Keiko, she shouldn't have kept breeding her. And now she is breeding her grand-daughters.

Finding Sampson's other siblings won't help Sampson's health. I'm just curious if others from his litter had similar issues.

Thanks for your response.
 

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Puddles
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I sort of figured there was no love lost between you but unaware of a law suit. So I did find an offspring on Ofa.org for Nautilus Purple Passion that was born 10/7/2007 - Ripley's White Wedding, call name "Billie" but her mom was named Gold-Rush Ripley's Ruby Tuesday, call name Ruby not Keiko... busy boy.
I had some issues with my breeder too but certainly not to the level you experienced. I have often wondered about the other pups in the litter so can completely understand wanting to know. I'm sorry for having so many problems with Sampson, life isn't supposed to be this hard for either of you.
Good luck on your quest and hope you get some responses.
 

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This is Amy from Signature Gold Goldens & I feel really bad for Sampson because he really deserves a home with someone who loves him completely. From day one you were worried about the price of your puppy And just days after you got your puppy you called saying if he has any problems I can get a refund right. I offered to take him back right from the start because you were worried about the cost of your puppy. Later you tried to take us to court for $5500 & you lost. you tried to say that your puppy could have hip issues in the future, and that is why you brought us to court & yes they are known for that as golden retriever bred & as we showed you in court all hip test done which are not just our dogs but their parents parents and many many generations back, all our dogs are from top breeders all over the us & even Europe. At the time you bought Sampson he was $1200. Lucky you because my dogs I buy to breed are $3500-$4500 And you are right my dog keiko did die 2016 and she was 12 1/2 old, God Bless her she was an amazing dog & a great companion & she was Sampson mom. In all my years as a breeder, you are my only person to complain. I Saw your post on google and if this slander continues I will have no choice but to file a defamation lawsuit.
 

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Kate
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@Amy - I agree it's insane taking a breeder to court over hip dysplasia.

Did have a question though for both you and the OP on some of the other things listed....

He was diagnosed with hip dysplasia at 9 months and he now has dilated cardiomyopathy, protein-losing nephropathy, liver disease, and hypothyroidism
I think that hypothyroidism needs to be stricken from the list because it is so common, particularly with older dogs.

The liver disease and kidney disease (protein-losing nephropathy) - are concerning if this happened when he was young. If they were late onset - the questions I would ask is what had been fed or given to the dog early on or through his life which may have contributed to both conditions. From what I understand... if it occurs later in life, it can be caused by a variety of things. Sometimes medications (prolonged use of pain meds or medications). Sometimes contact with toxins. Sometimes food (if fatty or poor quality food). Sometimes just simply aging or affects of something else (like the enlarged heart).

The enlarged heart is something that brings to mind the taurine deficiency thing that everyone is hyping up right now. Was wondering if anyone thought that could be tested at this point?

Or going back to the breeder - have you heard from anyone else?

I'm asking because I'm trying to decide if I'm "worried" about the Taurine stuff going around to the extent of getting my boys tested or not. Have never had heart issues with any of my dogs. But I do know people who oddly lose multiple dogs (of different breeds and kept in shape) to heart failure.
 

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And this is an older thread, though the breeder probably brought it to an even higher google rating by posting on an old thread. I too thought of taurine...
 

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Hi Megora
Puppies are not fully grown until they are 2 years old and OFA does not do X-ray ratings until they are fully groan, the owner of Sampson was like I said trying to get a full refund as soon as she took Sampson home but insisted she was going to keep him too. Her dog was not diagnosed with hip dysphasia, when she went to court she told the judge her dog COULD have Hip dysphasia in the future and she had nothing to stand on so it was thrown out of court. As far as any other health issues I have not heard a thing about any health issues with her dog Sampson until it was posted on google this April 2017 & when my vet read it he said she needs to be better informed as to what she is trying to say came from genetics. Everything we feed our dogs directly effect their health, so many people don't understand the impact of their dog food, so this is why we tell people to keep their dogs on a well balanced diet, we also add in our contract that our dogs get fed Bil-Jac which is an amazing dog food. Understandably most new puppy owners do not know this so we do our best to inform them. We also recommend NuVet vitamins for all our puppies and we start them on them at 8 weeks & that gets our puppies ready for their new homes at 10 weeks old. We have not had any complaints or anyone informing us of any heart or other health problems & we have been Breeding for 15 years
 

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Kate
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the owner of Sampson was like I said trying to get a full refund as soon as she took Sampson home but insisted she was going to keep him too. Her dog was not diagnosed with hip dysplasia, when she went to court she told the judge her dog COULD have Hip dysplasia in the future
My head is spinning at the audacity! All the more since she was seeking $6K in the lawsuit.

With my older dog who has hip dysplasia, I did have a guarantee. But it was as follows:

1. The dog had to have the hips/elbows checked with OFA. <= This included prelims since people get the hips checked at the time of neutering. They just wrote into the contract that vet opinion alone was not good enough. It had to be something officially from OFA. This also guaranteed that the hips would be set up properly (ofa positioning).

2. I had to provide vet information showing the weight of my dog and health history. Because written into the contract - I had to show I did not allow my dog to get obese nor was there an injury that possibly could have caused hip issues. Also, had to prove I did not neuter my dog early.

^^^ If I had the above, I was then entitled to get 1/2 the puppy price back on proof of neutering. The first 1/2 portion paid was nonrefundable.

^^^^ I wasn't interested in getting my money back nor did I wish to neuter him for health reasons (the breeder and I fully discussed this at the time I was given the contract).

But that's a typical guarantee. Other kind would require that the person return the dog in order to get their money back.

Only other thing I've heard as far as people getting their money back is if something catastrophic goes wrong very early with a puppy....
 

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My beloved veteran dog Tally is a Casanova grandson, and I had the great pleasure of watching Casanova show at Yankee Golden has a white faced old man. He lived a very long life, and was a dog I just loved with the friendliest temperament . My heart goes out to Sampson, and all goldens struggling with chronic health issues. The thing is, it is human nature to blame breeders , but so much of the time we simply do not know why some dogs( and humans) get sick or thrive. No breeder every wants anything sad or bad to befall the babies they raise with so much hope for their futures. I have made mistakes in selecting pups, and I have to take responsibility for failing in my on due diligence or simply accept that creating living things is perilous sometimes even when intentions are pure. Although I also live in Maine, I have never met Amy at shows or obedience/agility etc so I really don't have any knowledge of the program.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
@Lovemydogs4ever2 (Amy): Please don't imply that Sampson didn't go to a loving home. That is ridiculous. He has been loved and very well taken care of since day 1. He has been fed high quality food and supplements needed for his hips and has had top-notch medical care. The cost of Sampson wasn't an issue. The health guarantee was, as it was unclear as to what was covered and what the recourse was in the case of illness or health issues. I showed it to several lawyers who agreed with me and who advised me to take legal action regarding his hips. I am not just a money-hungry person who had buyers remorse after purchasing a puppy. I was trying to do the best for Sampson who, in the opinion of my veterinarian and an orthopedic specialist at Tufts Veterinary Hospital, would need surgery to replace at least one hip. The vet at Tufts wanted to do the surgery at 1 year as Sampson was already showing arthritic changes on x-ray. This isn't something I just made up and it certainly isn't what I wanted for Sampson. And, for the record, the reason the law suit was thrown out was because my damages exceeded the amount that could be awarded in small claims court, not because you won any legal argument.

We continue to do our very best for Sampson and have spent about $4000 in diagnostics and medicine since December for his current illnesses and issues. His hips are bad enough that he drags his back feet when they get sore or tired enough. His pain is being managed medically. I lift and/or carry him when he needs some help and I bought him a special stroller so that he can still enjoy walks with us and can always be with us. So, whatever you say, PLEASE don't try to say I don't love him. You have no idea.

There are 2 sides to every story and people reading and responding to this thread can choose to believe whichever side they'd like, but only you and I know what really happened. My Google Review is honest and truthful. There is not one word in it that is untrue so, there is no slander or defamation there.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
@Megora (Kate): Sampson was always fed high quality food as suggested by our vet. His hip dysplasia was managed with supplements and has just started on pain meds now. He has been healthy (except his hips) until just after turning 9 and we still don't have a definitive diagnosis. We know he has hypothyroidism, some age-related liver disease and protein losing nephropathy, A recent re-test echo-cardiogram indicates that he has some thickening of his mitral valve, but his heart seems to be pumping ok. He has an overall weakness that they can't seem to diagnose, but he's holding his own for now. L-taurine supplements were suggested for his heart.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
My head is spinning at the audacity! All the more since she was seeking $6K in the lawsuit.

With my older dog who has hip dysplasia, I did have a guarantee. But it was as follows:

1. The dog had to have the hips/elbows checked with OFA. <= This included prelims since people get the hips checked at the time of neutering. They just wrote into the contract that vet opinion alone was not good enough. It had to be something officially from OFA. This also guaranteed that the hips would be set up properly (ofa positioning).

2. I had to provide vet information showing the weight of my dog and health history. Because written into the contract - I had to show I did not allow my dog to get obese nor was there an injury that possibly could have caused hip issues. Also, had to prove I did not neuter my dog early.

^^^ If I had the above, I was then entitled to get 1/2 the puppy price back on proof of neutering. The first 1/2 portion paid was nonrefundable.

^^^^ I wasn't interested in getting my money back nor did I wish to neuter him for health reasons (the breeder and I fully discussed this at the time I was given the contract).

But that's a typical guarantee. Other kind would require that the person return the dog in order to get their money back.

Only other thing I've heard as far as people getting their money back is if something catastrophic goes wrong very early with a puppy....

@Megora (Kate): Please don't categorize me as audacious. You don't know the whole story and are only choosing to believe half of it. Sampson WAS diagnosed with hip dysplassia at 9 months. The diagnosis came from my vet and OFA. OFA categorized his hips as MODERATE hip dysplasia. I had his x-rays done at the time of his neutering, as you suggest in your post. Also, as you suggest in your post, I only originally asked for half of the price of the puppy back when I got the diagnosis, just as you indicate was the recourse in your health contract. I had all of the documentation that you say was required in your contract to get half of the price of the puppy back. I only sued when I had two medical opinions that hip replacement surgery would be needed and I sued for the price of one surgery as advised by three lawyers. The law suit was dismissed without prejudice (meaning I could sue in superior court) because my damages exceeded the amount allowed in small claims court in the state of Maine. I am not the uncaring, money-hungry person that Amy is trying to portray me as. I was trying to do the best for Sampson, who I love very much. Try not to jump to conclusions based on one side of the story.
 

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Kate
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I only sued when I had two medical opinions that hip replacement surgery would be needed and I sued for the price of one surgery as advised by three lawyers.
Here's the issue.

Hip dyplasia is genetic across the board. It's why every generation gets their hips (and elbows checked). It's in the breed.

And it is also caused or exasperated by environmental stuff + neutering early.

I removed the rest because it was something of an explosion of astonishment that anyone would sue a breeder to cover hip surgery for moderate hip dysplasia. There's need for common sense. Don't burn your bridges.

^^^^ And might add. I don't know the breeder. Have not gone out of my way to look them up or spend too much energy doing so. LOL. I did think twice about whether or not the breeder actually DID full clearances or not. Or if they were one of those that has it plastered all over their websites that their dogs are genetically free of X or Y stuff because they are special. :)

I do think that even if you did purchase a puppy whose parents do not have full clearances behind them, it was something you did at your own risk. I don't think you can or "should" sue unless you can prove the breeder was really deliberately breeding dogs who have catastrophic hips and were producing the same.
 

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@Lovemydogs4ever2 (Amy): Please don't imply that Sampson didn't go to a loving home. That is ridiculous. He has been loved and very well taken care of since day 1. He has been fed high quality food and supplements needed for his hips and has had top-notch medical care. The cost of Sampson wasn't an issue. The health guarantee was, as it was unclear as to what was covered and what the recourse was in the case of illness or health issues. I showed it to several lawyers who agreed with me and who advised me to take legal action regarding his hips. I am not just a money-hungry person who had buyers remorse after purchasing a puppy. I was trying to do the best for Sampson who, in the opinion of my veterinarian and an orthopedic specialist at Tufts Veterinary Hospital, would need surgery to replace at least one hip. The vet at Tufts wanted to do the surgery at 1 year as Sampson was already showing arthritic changes on x-ray. This isn't something I just made up and it certainly isn't what I wanted for Sampson. And, for the record, the reason the law suit was thrown out was because my damages exceeded the amount that could be awarded in small claims court, not because you won any legal argument.

We continue to do our very best for Sampson and have spent about $4000 in diagnostics and medicine since December for his current illnesses and issues. His hips are bad enough that he drags his back feet when they get sore or tired enough. His pain is being managed medically. I lift and/or carry him when he needs some help and I bought him a special stroller so that he can still enjoy walks with us and can always be with us. So, whatever you say, PLEASE don't try to say I don't love him. You have no idea.

There are 2 sides to every story and people reading and responding to this thread can choose to believe whichever side they'd like, but only you and I know what really happened. My Google Review is honest and truthful. There is not one word in it that is untrue so, there is no slander or defamation there.
I'm truly sorry if my opinion did hurt your feelings that is not my intention but it truly was my opinion. I just don't understand how you have so many health concerns with Sampson but instead of contacting me you posted the problems on google & in this forum? I guess I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish in hunting down his siblings, I spoke to my Vet when I saw your post on google about the health issues you posted & his opinion was you haven't been informed with information as to the health concerns instead of blaming his genetics. I am not a person who likes confrontation or he said she said so again if there were health concerns then you should have contacted me to address your concerns. I will not go back and fourth like this on these chats, but I wish you all the best with Sampson.
 
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