[AmberSunrise]

I am beginning to think of the ‘setup’ training needed for Hunt Tests and WC / WCX for my dogs and would like feedback if possible on coming to the line.

The perfect performance steps I see in coming to the line from the blind are:

1) Him being quiet in the blind and attentive to me
2) Leaving the blind under control, close to heel position and not visiting people or any birds that may be near as we go to the line. I do not plan on using HEEL but rather ‘Let’s Go’ – a more informal positional command to me.
3) Properly lining up his spine to my position (push/pull as needed) with a minimum of fuss or excess motion once we get to the line.
4) Sitting quietly, without creeping, lunging, or breaking through
- any bird calls
- any gun shots
- the bird being thrown / shot
- him marking the fall and ‘locking on’
- through the judge saying ‘Dog’ or his number
I plan on using my left hand coming down to a few inches above his head and between his eyes to point and act as almost a ‘Get Set’ cue, so he must sit quietly here too. I may also teach the setup from my right side.

5) Leaving immediately and enthusiastically once sent – so far not an issue LOL


I am still trying to picture my ‘perfect performance’ or training steps on the line manners from a boat or a ‘walk up’ situation, but if I train as for the above is there anything that might conflict with blind retrieves as training progresses?

Are there additional scenarios that should be trained and / or introduced? For example, once in the blind is it a reasonable wait before being called or should I also train for a down or more relaxed position?

Thoughts and suggestions would be much appreciated.
Thanks

 

[DNL2448]

One thing I am going to do differently then in the past, is I am going to have him sit on my right side for all honor work. He will know (hopefully) that if he is on my right, he is not to go after the bird. This will come into play in the Senior division.

Sounds like you are on the right track. There is a good book (Cassity???) on training drills and she discusses line/blind work. I'll thumb through it and see if there is anything else that would be helpful for you.

 

[hotel4dogs]

wow, what an awesome idea! Thanks for sharing it!!

One thing I am going to do differently then in the past, is I am going to have him sit on my right side for all honor work. He will know (hopefully) that if he is on my right, he is not to go after the bird. This will come into play in the Senior division.

Sounds like you are on the right track. There is a good book (Cassity???) on training drills and she discusses line/blind work. I'll thumb through it and see if there is anything else that would be helpful for you.

 

[Swampcollie]

I am still trying to picture my ‘perfect performance’ or training steps on the line manners from a boat or a ‘walk up’ situation, but if I train as for the above is there anything that might conflict with blind retrieves as training progresses?

Boats can be a problem if the dog has never been in one. There have been a number of dogs over the years that just flat out refused to get into the boat. (Hint, if the dog balks at getting into a strange boat, give your command to "kennel".) Remember that leaving a platform or boat often means directly entering deep water. Make certain your dog has experienced deep water entries prior to Testing, or you may creat a water entry problem.

In a "walk-up" situation you simply have to demonstrate control of the dog. Most Judges won't demand that the dog be glued to your inseam. Once the bird is "in the air", sit or stop the dog via a whistle or verbal command. (One or the other, not both!)

Are there additional scenarios that should be trained and / or introduced? For example, once in the blind is it a reasonable wait before being called or should I also train for a down or more relaxed position?

Depending upon the test and the working dog ahead of you, it could be a long wait in the holding blind. If your dog is more comfortable doing a long down stay, it certainly won't hurt your cause. There have been some Senior Test scenarios that took close to twenty minutes per dog to complete.

One thing I am going to do differently then in the past, is I am going to have him sit on my right side for all honor work. He will know (hopefully) that if he is on my right, he is not to go after the bird.

While that may work in some test setups, it may not always be possible. The honor box may be placed so it simply isn't possible to be located on the left side of the dog without blocking the dogs' ability to see the marks. Then again you may be faced with a remote honor, where the dog isn't going to be beside you by design of the test. You're going to be better off working on teaching the dog to honor no matter where it's placed.

 

[AmberSunrise]

Sounds like you are on the right track. There is a good book (Cassity???) on training drills and she discusses line/blind work. I'll thumb through it and see if there is anything else that would be helpful for you.

Is this 'Building a Retriever: Drills & More' book? I was looking at this book and it seems like it is probably a good book to get .. would you recommend it? Thanks

 

[DNL2448]

Is this 'Building a Retriever: Drills & More' book? I was looking at this book and it seems like it is probably a good book to get .. would you recommend it? Thanks

Yes, that's it. And, yes, I would recommend it! It's great and so easy to use and understand. I bring it with us when we have training days and we pick drills to work from it. Have fun, I sure do.

 

[AmberSunrise]

Boats can be a problem if the dog has never been in one. There have been a number of dogs over the years that just flat out refused to get into the boat. (Hint, if the dog balks at getting into a strange boat, give your command to "kennel".) Remember that leaving a platform or boat often means directly entering deep water. Make certain your dog has experienced deep water entries prior to Testing, or you may creat a water entry problem.
....
In a "walk-up" situation you simply have to demonstrate control of the dog. Most Judges won't demand that the dog be glued to your inseam. Once the bird is "in the air", sit or stop the dog via a whistle or verbal command. (One or the other, not both!)
....
Depending upon the test and the working dog ahead of you, it could be a long wait in the holding blind. If your dog is more comfortable doing a long down stay, it certainly won't hurt your cause. There have been some Senior Test scenarios that took close to twenty minutes per dog to complete.

Wow - thanks so much!! Okay, I definitely have work to do with getting them ready; they have not entered deep water from any type of platform unless a dock counts; I will need to borrow a boat <grins> and work on your other comments.

 

[K9-Design]

Hi, great thread. I work very hard at being consistent going from blind to line. Here is what I do.

<<1) Him being quiet in the blind and attentive to me>>

I heel the dog into the blind then back him into it with a "heel" command so his back is to the blind. SIT and I walk away leaving the dog in a sit in the blind. I am just at the end of the leash or a step away but the dog is expected to sit and not move around, sniff all over, jump on me, peek under the blind, etc, etc, etc because SIT MEANS SIT.

<<2) Leaving the blind under control, close to heel position and not visiting people or any birds that may be near as we go to the line. I do not plan on using HEEL but rather ‘Let’s Go’ – a more informal positional command to me.>>

HEEL in field training means BACK UP. This is actually pretty darn useful getting out of the blind and going to the line. You don't want the dog to think "LET'S GO- WWOOOO HOO!!!!!" you want the dog under control -- with HEEL meaning BACK UP you have more control. You WANT it to be formal, the less formal you are, the less control you have. Trust me the dog won't be visiting people he will be running out ahead of you to get those birdies, unless you have control.
I keep the dog in a sit behind the blind, walk to the left or right of the blind, whichever side gives a better view of the field, and call the dog to heel. Let him sit in heel position and settle, view the field, before heeling forward.

<<I plan on using my left hand coming down to a few inches above his head and between his eyes to point and act as almost a ‘Get Set’ cue, so he must sit quietly here too. I may also teach the setup from my right side.>>

Just to clarify but the left hand over the dog's head is not something you do to show them where the birds will fall or for them to get ready. If you do this before you signal you are ready for birds to go down judges are going to get you for pointing out the gun stations to the bird. The left hand over the head is more a matter of steadying, by habit the dog knows he is not to leave until your hand is down. Your hand goes down AFTER the bird is thrown, AFTER the judges have called your number, and AFTER you are sure the dog is focused on where the bird is. Then when you are ready to send, it's hand and dog's name.

<<5) Leaving immediately and enthusiastically once sent – so far not an issue LOL>>

Hopefully not! he he

<<I am still trying to picture my ‘perfect performance’ or training steps on the line manners from a boat or a ‘walk up’ situation, but if I train as for the above is there anything that might conflict with blind retrieves as training progresses?>>

Just for sake of keeping commands the same, again, in field training "heel" means back up or go left -- PUSH. "Here" means to me, turn right -- PULL. This is important for lining up for marks and blinds.

<<Are there additional scenarios that should be trained and / or introduced? For example, once in the blind is it a reasonable wait before being called or should I also train for a down or more relaxed position?>>

Some dogs are fine with a down in the blind but a lot of other ones think that means go crazy sniffing the ground or crawl under the blind! Sit will probably work just as well.
Hope this helps. Great thread!

 

[AmberSunrise]

Yes, thanks It helps a lot.

Hi, great thread. I work very hard at being consistent going from blind to line. Here is what I do.

<<1) Him being quiet in the blind and attentive to me>>

I heel the dog into the blind then back him into it with a "heel" command so his back is to the blind. SIT and I walk away leaving the dog in a sit in the blind. I am just at the end of the leash or a step away but the dog is expected to sit and not move around, sniff all over, jump on me, peek under the blind, etc, etc, etc because SIT MEANS SIT.

<<2) Leaving the blind under control, close to heel position and not visiting people or any birds that may be near as we go to the line. I do not plan on using HEEL but rather ‘Let’s Go’ – a more informal positional command to me.>>

HEEL in field training means BACK UP. This is actually pretty darn useful getting out of the blind and going to the line. You don't want the dog to think "LET'S GO- WWOOOO HOO!!!!!" you want the dog under control -- with HEEL meaning BACK UP you have more control. You WANT it to be formal, the less formal you are, the less control you have. Trust me the dog won't be visiting people he will be running out ahead of you to get those birdies, unless you have control.
I keep the dog in a sit behind the blind, walk to the left or right of the blind, whichever side gives a better view of the field, and call the dog to heel. Let him sit in heel position and settle, view the field, before heeling forward.

<<I plan on using my left hand coming down to a few inches above his head and between his eyes to point and act as almost a ‘Get Set’ cue, so he must sit quietly here too. I may also teach the setup from my right side.>>

Just to clarify but the left hand over the dog's head is not something you do to show them where the birds will fall or for them to get ready. If you do this before you signal you are ready for birds to go down judges are going to get you for pointing out the gun stations to the bird. The left hand over the head is more a matter of steadying, by habit the dog knows he is not to leave until your hand is down. Your hand goes down AFTER the bird is thrown, AFTER the judges have called your number, and AFTER you are sure the dog is focused on where the bird is. Then when you are ready to send, it's hand and dog's name.

<<5) Leaving immediately and enthusiastically once sent – so far not an issue LOL>>

Hopefully not! he he

<<I am still trying to picture my ‘perfect performance’ or training steps on the line manners from a boat or a ‘walk up’ situation, but if I train as for the above is there anything that might conflict with blind retrieves as training progresses?>>

Just for sake of keeping commands the same, again, in field training "heel" means back up or go left -- PUSH. "Here" means to me, turn right -- PULL. This is important for lining up for marks and blinds.

<<Are there additional scenarios that should be trained and / or introduced? For example, once in the blind is it a reasonable wait before being called or should I also train for a down or more relaxed position?>>

Some dogs are fine with a down in the blind but a lot of other ones think that means go crazy sniffing the ground or crawl under the blind! Sit will probably work just as well.
Hope this helps. Great thread!