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So..., Maggie and I went for a walk this morning in a new location, an adventure of sorts. We meet a couple walking a golden and a Boston Terrier. Conversation goes the usual route..., age, gender, food and where'd you get him from. So, when the where did you get him from comes the comment, "he's 60 something percent English." I thought that meant English pedigree. But then came the part of completion, "English Cream." I asked her if she were a member of GRF and she said no. I expressed how much I have learned since I joined. I even went on to say that the topic of "English Cream," has been addressed on the forum and that it was a red flag. I wasnt nasty or anything, but perhaps I shouldn't even get into these discussions. Do you ever find yourself getting into these discussions? How did you handle it. She said she likes the lighter ones. I told her I actually like the darker ones as far as color. I told her about the GRF and if she were interested to come visit or join. I told her it's all about the GR breed and they come in all colors. I think she was kind of put off when I said that "English Cream," is a red flag.
 

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Kate
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Face to face... I wouldn't get into it. I would just nod, smile, and change the subject. And that's really about anything that I feel very strongly about.
 

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Love my Golden Boys!!
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Regardless of where my guys came from, I have learned alot since joining the forum and try to pass that on to other potential Golden owners.....most of the time, I might as well be talking to a brick wall!!!

At least you tried........
 

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I agree with most other posters. They're happy with their dog, and don't care about what some "Golden Retriever Establishment" says about them; in fact, they might interpret some of the rhetoric as a whole community dedicated to bad mouthing their dogs...even though that really isn't the intent of the community. I'd leave it alone
 

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I was at the vet with Bing (who has been very sick the past couple of weeks... ) and the conversation goes the same... people have asked me if he is an english cream and I just say that he is a golden retriever.

We were walking connie downtown and people have asked if she was an english cream and again I say that she is just a golden retriever... I don't get into it at all... whats the point... if someone asks my opinion I will tell them... but with strangers on a walk? never.
 

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I'd leave it alone as well, especially since this was an initial meeting. The other people obviously love their Golden and won't appreciate any criticism, especially from a stranger on first meeting. If someone had done something like that to me I'd probably want to avoid that person on walks in the future, just because walks are supposed to be good and fun times for people and dogs. JMO.
 

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Tracer, Rumor & Cady
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most people dont take kindly to learning they they've might have been snookered...but think they do take in the information better if they're allowed to learn in small doses and without face to face confrontation.
 
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New Mommy
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I tried taking this approach with Jordan's little Goldendoodle friend from puppy class. Every time I saw them, I would gently point out that he wasn't really a purebred and even warned her that sooner or later, if she kept hanging out with purebred people, someone was going to nail her. Then she gave me the breeders website and asked me what I thought. It's a puppymill, totally. They do the whole Nuvet and "you have to feed our food", some mail order stuff I have never heard of. Again, as nicely as I could I said that I thought that her dog was a sweetheart and he deservered to be loved and cherished and it seemed like he would work out well for her needs. ( he hasn't), but I was very concerned about the breeder, from her website it didn't appear that she was doing anything the way a good Golden breeder does. She even told me that now she was beginning to feel that way a bit too. Then we were in dog class and someone asked about him and she started the whole thing about how he was a new breed of Goldens and she would happily give them the breeder info. I lost it, there were several Golden people standing around very interested in this "miniature" Golden, so I said "He's from a puppy mill, a very expensive mix breed dog and that anybody who loved and cared about the Golden breed would never buy one of these dogs". I did go on to explain that his owner knew none of this when she bought him , trusted the wrong person and I didn't blame her. But now these I was talking to, people knew better and they have no excuse.
As you can guess, we don't speak much, which I am very sad about. But if I kept one person from buying these dogs, well I guess it was worth it. There is no good way to do this. You are going to offend and anger people, but it is never going to stop unless we do say something.:no:
 

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Kate
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@Claire's Friend - I probably would have blown a gasket if I heard somebody talking like that. I admire you for having the guts to step up.
 

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You are going to offend and anger people, but it is never going to stop unless we do say something.:no:
It's not going to stop, anyway...unless there happens to be legislation that prevents it, and even then, it's unlikely to stop. People don't buy Golden Doodles or "English Creme" goldens because they care about the breed. They buy them either on impulse as a result of their "cuteness," unscrupulous marketing by the breeder, adoption, gift, or any other of the hundred reasons the average pet owner gets a dog.

I would argue (although it's not really in my nature to argue) that members on GRF are not "average" pet owners. Often they care about the breed so much, they'll argue their case to the point of getting banned from the site.

People don't want to get lectured, and if they do, they go to church. They certainly don't want to get lectured about what an irresponsible consumer they are because they bought a chic "breed," that violates (what they consider) arbitrary and inconsequential standards developed by people they don't know that mean nothing to them.

That's why, I don't think there's any point in telling and/or lecturing people about their choice in dog. That's what forums like GRF are good for: identify breeders that are selling dogs that violate the standards, inform others who care about this, and move on. IMHO
 

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So it's just the name?

Okey dokey.......it seems this is a hot topic even on here.......
No, it's not just the name. Irresponsible breeders who are only breeding to make money and don't care about the quality of the dogs they are breeding, or the health of the puppies they are producing, use the term "English Cream" to lure in people who are not well educated in Golden Retrievers and are looking for very light colored dogs. These breeders charge extremely high prices for supposedly rare or better puppies simply because their coat is light color. It's a scam, like charging more for a red sports car than you do the exact same model car in blue.
 

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Wyatt Earp
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No, it's not just the name. Irresponsible breeders who are only breeding to make money and don't care about the quality of the dogs they are breeding, or the health of the puppies they are producing, use the term "English Cream" to lure in people who are not well educated in Golden Retrievers and are looking for very light colored dogs. These breeders charge extremely high prices for supposedly rare or better puppies simply because their coat is light color. It's a scam, like charging more for a red sports car than you do the exact same model car in blue.
So all that breed English are irresponsible breeders?
 

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I would leave it alone... What gets me going is when potential puppy people call me and ask if I breed "blockhead Goldens". Inviting them to the forum is one thing... But it can come off to a pet owner as an insult to their dog....
 
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...use the term "English Cream" to lure in people who are not well educated in Golden Retrievers and are looking for very light colored dogs. These breeders charge extremely high prices for supposedly rare or better puppies simply because their coat is light color.
You do hit the nail on the head in terms of the education level of the buyer - that doesn't speak to their intelligence, by any means, but it does perhaps speak to their level of vanity or impulsiveness. A concern I would have is that dispelling their myth that they have a super-special, rare breed of dog might prompt them to get rid of the dog, which results in (yet another) dog at the animal shelter. I may have just dug myself into a slippery slope with that assumption, but it's not out of the realm of possibility, especially if the dog has behavioral issues as a puppy.

In this case, the damage is already done because they've already bought the dog from the unsrupulous breeder -- caveat emptor. Why drop a bomb on a friendship because a person didn't investigate enough a personal purchase?

If a person is running a puppy mill, they should be reported; but, if the seller lives up to the terms of the contract and isn't selling an illegal product, there's no law against taking advantage of ill-informed consumers (have you visited a Best Buy or car dealership lately?).
 

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A dog becomes a cherished member of a person's family, and many times an extension of the person him/herself. I have met so many dog owners proudly sporting dogs that I personally would not want to own - such as a Pit Bull wearing a huge spiked collar and muzzle out in public.

I try to avoid any breed discussions and simply find something positive to say about that dog while keeping my thoughts to myself.

I agree that there are many breeders who are only in it for the $$$$ but once a person buys a puppy mill dog and bonds with it the deed is done. If you came across a couple with an adopted child that was handicapped, homely, etc. would you advise them to give it back?
 
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