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a new day everyday
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everyone

Ever since we got our golden retriever puppy, nearly 11 weeks old now, we have not had many firm stools.

The breeder was feeding him Pedigree Puppy Wet Food and Burgess Puppy ( dry food) www.[B]burgess[/B]petcare.co.uk/.

It never occured to us that runny poo would be an indication of digestion problems whatsoever.

Having read much about diets online, I came to realize that only a few companies provide dog food which is of quality and good for the dogs.

One of these companies is Orijen.

Since here in the UK, Orijen is quite expensive £53.99 for 13.5 Kg we decided to opt for another dog food which is, apparently, quite good, and less expensive and goes by the name of James WellBeloved.

So we decided to try that and weane him off Burgess and Pedigree.

His stool didn't improve at all. When we told the vet, he obviously suggested to go for Science Plan ( a specific diet for diarheaa) but I wasn't too keen on it. I am aware that vets receive very little education and training on nutrition and are paid to promote food from Iams, Eukanuba and Sciecne Plan.

We decided to move onto Orijen Puppy Large then but again, the dog did not seem to take it well. He even threw up once.

Trying not to worry, we decided to just give him chicken with rice to see if there was any problem with the dog causing diarrhea.

After his first chicken & rice meal, the dog had his first firm stool. We have since been feeding him chicken and rice, and we've seen a lot of difference in his poo and his level of activity.


May I add that most of the changes in the food were gradual and not immediate.

Today, we decided to try Orijen again, crashing the kibbles into little pieces, with rice and chicken and again we could see that his stool was starting to become wet again.


We simply don't have the time to be cooking for the dog. I have found out that there's another good dog food, Acana, and keen on trying that one as well. I just don't want to keep on switching foods for my dog as I am aware it can be damaging for his stomach and upset it.

I should also note that many brands which are available in the States, are not available in the UK. These include, Natura, Natura Evo, Taste of the Wild and so on.
UK people, correct me If I am wrong.

I seek out for your help, advice and expertise on nutritional information and premium food that will give my puppy firm stools.


Thanks a lot
 

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Some foods are just too rich for some dogs. I want to point out that you're correct that vets don't receive a ton of education regarding nutrition- but they aren't paid by the food companies. The prescription diets are vital to some dog's survival becuase they're specially formulated. The non-prescription diets, I'd never feed!

If you can try a food with a lower amount of protein, that might be helpful. Are you transitioning very s..l..o..w..l..y over a two week period from the Pedigree (yuck!) to the Acana/Orijen?

Can you find Nature's Variety-Instinct, Fromm, Canidae, Merrick, in the UK?
 

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I went through the same thing with my pup, was good on chicken/rice mostly rice. We had her on ca. natural puppy chicken, she did better, but not great, when she was 10 mos. we changed to wellness simple solution/ lamb and rice not one soft stool, I am even putting in nutritous foods like fruit and veg. has done great. I am thinking, as a puppy alot of her problem was getting things in the yard although everthing was cleaned up in the yard. Could your puppy be getting into something. As for orgen or blue buffalo I have heard they are very rich food, natural balance has a food for sesitive stomach also, you need a food with limited ingredients. Good luck I know what your going through. Wish I had changed sooner.
 

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a new day everyday
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks to both for your replies.

Carolina Casey:

No I don't think I have transitioned that slowly from James WellBeloved to Orijen.

So If I were to continue on coocked Chicken and Rice how much of Orijen would i have to put per meal to see if his stomach can slowly handle it?

I have also heard that Orijen can be quite harsh on puppies, but is that because of the abrupt transition or will it continue to be like that throughout his entire life?

I don't like the idea of excluding Orijen from the list as I have heard so many positive things about and would like my dog to receive the best out there.


I've done everything in my power to find out if someone imports Wellness but I haven't found anything so far.

I have found this website http://www.postalpetsproducts.co.uk/
which I think provides Fromm.

But I don't think I can find Merrick, Nature's Variety-Instict or Canidae.


58loosy:

As I said, we don't have Wellness in the UK, again if someone knows more than I do, I'd be grateful to have a place where I can get it from.

I am very alert outside so whenever I see him get something into hims mouth I take it out unless I know for sure he's not going to eat it. He sometimes eats grass but I don't think that's bad, or is it?
 

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They our little stinkers about putting things in there mouth, lol. Grass wouldn't affect the stool may throw up if tummy upset. I hear that lamb is more gentle on there stomach, I wish I had looked for lamb in puppy food, my vet who doesn't know much about nutrition said to find a chicken puppy food, so I did.
 

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Has his stool been tested at the vet for parasites/giardia/etc?

Has the vet prescribed Flagyl/Metrondiazole? That could help the GI problems.

When you're transitioning, you should do 1/4 Orijen, 3/4 Pedigree for 4-5 days, then 1/2 of each for 5 days, then 3/4 Orijen & 1/4 Pedigree for 5-7 days, then 100% Orijen. Have you totally gone off of the Pedigree? You may need to buy a small bag.
 

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Aside from any internal issues such as parasites, I would suggest that Orijen Puppy Large is a bit too rich for a very young puppy. Would you consider looking into Innova Large Puppy?

I will use what my breeder uses, but will *eventually* move to another food. I prefer grain free for my border collies and I had them on Evo. However, that was when they were herding. I've lost the possibility to take them herding now so I am in the process of switching them to Orijen Senior (they're 8 and 11) and they're doing very well.
For Max I will just have to really see what I do, he will be my first golden . I can't switch him to grain free until he's much older.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Has his stool been tested at the vet for parasites/giardia/etc?

Has the vet prescribed Flagyl/Metrondiazole? That could help the GI problems.

When you're transitioning, you should do 1/4 Orijen, 3/4 Pedigree for 4-5 days, then 1/2 of each for 5 days, then 3/4 Orijen & 1/4 Pedigree for 5-7 days, then 100% Orijen. Have you totally gone off of the Pedigree? You may need to buy a small bag.
Well no, we haven't had his poo examined.
The vet hasn't prescribed anything because we wanted to see whether his stool would turn out to be firm before proceeding with any stool examination/prescriptions.
We have seen that with chicken and rice his stool turned out to be very firm. Puppy has been vaccinated at week 7 for Duramune and at week 9. He will also get another one at week 12 just to be on the safe side.

The vet didn't realize that puppy was 9 weeks and 3 days when he had his second vaccination.
According to Duramune, the first vaccination can be done from week 6 to week 8 and the second vaccination can be injected as early as 10 weeks. But not before.

Lilliam :

I would consider Innova Large Puppy had it been available in the UK.
 

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You may have to back up a step, change the puppy over to a different food over at least two weeks, slowing increasing the new food, etc.

You won't see immediate results, it may take several weeks. Give it at least a month on the new food to see if his stool improves.

Make sure your vet has tested for intestinal parasites, including giardia and coccidia. No matter what food he is on if he has an intestinal parasite his stool will not be firm.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
You may have to back up a step, change the puppy over to a different food over at least two weeks, slowing increasing the new food, etc.

You won't see immediate results, it may take several weeks. Give it at least a month on the new food to see if his stool improves.

Make sure your vet has tested for intestinal parasites, including giardia and coccidia. No matter what food he is on if he has an intestinal parasite his stool will not be firm.
I am more than happy to do that, just to be on the safe side,
but wouldnt that mean ( if he had a parasite, or giardia, coccidia) that when he was given rice and chicken, he would still have diarrhea?

When we made rice and chicken for him, all diarrhea stopped. His stool was firm.
 

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I am more than happy to do that, just to be on the safe side,
but wouldnt that mean ( if he had a parasite, or giardia, coccidia) that when he was given rice and chicken, he would still have diarrhea?

When we made rice and chicken for him, all diarrhea stopped. His stool was firm.

No, it must be checked. You should never assume that because the stool is more formed on rice that there are no internal parasites or problems. Even puppies from the best of breeders can have worms. This is something that is very important and will need to be done at least 2 times in puppyhood, IMO as a vet tech.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
I know a lot of you are experienced with goldens and not only...

So what do you think is really good dog food t for a puppy whose stomach is sensitive?

Obviously Orijen causes diarrhea so I will not be giving him any more of that for now.

Is there anything as good, but not as rich as Orijen which could be what's causing him to runny stool?

Has anyone heard of Acana? Is Acana as rich as Orijen?

Anything which has plenty of chicken and rice to start with until he's fully grown?

I will also have the puppy tested for internal parasites, giardia or coccidia to exclude any possibilities. Is there a name for this sort of test? Does the vet send the stool to a chemist?

Many thanks again
 

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I switched Ranger from Iams to Orijen and it took a LONG time before his poop firmed up. I did the gradual change but at 3 weeks, he'd still get the runs if it was JUST Orijen in his bowl and no Iams. It took him about 2 months of getting used to the Orijen because his system was so used to grains. The last week, he was getting 1.5 cups of Orijen and a tablespoon of the Iams. After that, he was fine.

Orijen is a GREAT food. Ranger did really well on it until the formula change - after that, it just didn't agree with him. It was definitely worth the wait and the long, slow process of getting his system used to a rich, grain-free food. Since then, he's been swapped (with NO transition period) to other similar food with no issues. He's gone from Orijen to GO! to EVO to Acana and hasn't had any problems.

Do they have Go! or Now! in the UK? That's also a great food - my old border collie was fed that and he thrived on it.
 

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My 3 Goldens are on Orijen Adult - All Life Stages (Regional Red formula). Previously they were on Horizon but we felt the extra protein was needed. They are doing wonderfully on Orijen. We made the transition slow as Orijen is a mcuh richer food. As good a food as Horizon is, we've found their droppings to be cut in half and always firm. We're always commenting on nice their poops are.....

You might try sticking with the Orijen but introduce it very gradually.....you can also check the Orijen and Acana websites to compare ingredients and nutritional values. That's how we chose Orijen.
 

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Anecdotal note: We started raw feeding our cats (!) a few years ago. When we go on vacation, we don't ask the pet-sitter to deal with that, so they get canned food. And their stool is ALWAYS softer and way stinkier when we get back. A couple of meals of raw food and they're firm and fairly dry...and fewer of them, too. I've heard of some cats with Irritable Bowel Syndrome getting way better on the same diet.

I don't know that much about puppies yet, still in the process of researching it. But I thought I'd mention the cats, since we've been doing it with THEM for about five years or so. Helps to trim them down, too. One is diabetic, so it's important that he's not overweight.

We order our stuff from Know Better Pet Food; I know that they have a UK distribution for dogs, too.

??
 

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The only way .....

I could manage with my last Golden was to go grain free. I cooked for her for years and then when grain free came along I tried it and it worked,firm poops ...yahoo. With my relatively new golden (16 months tomorrow) I did grain free right away.
 

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Flora had diarrhea for about 9 months before we finally got her to having firm stools. She was tested several times for parasites (negative every time), and was put on anti-diarrhea medicines a couple of times. I sympathize, it's no fun. :(
 

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I experienced the same nightmare as you, but for a much longer period. Until Emma was 10 months it was a nightmare for all of us, only very loose stools, extremely frequent diarrhea & throwing up...I switched on raw and I was amazed. Since then no more troubles!

I like the fact that I am in perfect control with everything she eats, it is really human grade food. She developed super(unlike when she was on kibble, she was on Acana among others) , she is perfectly healthy, active and happy! Like you, I also do not cook for her, only on rare occasions. Perhaps you would like to give raw food a shot :)
 
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