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Exactly!!! This is why it is so difficult for goldens to do things like win Best In Show at Westminster. It is a big breed numbers wise , and within a larger group of very nice goldens with lovely breed type, there can be many different styles. It is not easy to line up a breed judge, a group judge , and a best in show judge who all endorse and prefer the same style to that degree.

In rare breeds, there may be just a handful all of similar style. It is a different ballgame.

This applies to showing in specialties too. If there are several dogs of equal caliber breed type, then the judge may defer to his/ her/ their favorite style in good conscience.

It is easier to show a golden who appeals to a variety of tastes, and has excellent breed type as well as style that appeals to many. Easy isn't better though.

It is better to have the motto "to thine own dog be true" and stay the course with the style in which you believe once you are very sure you know the details of breed type and have good breed type in your dogs.

I've had dogs who are effortless to finish, finishing in just a few shows; I've had dogs who appeal to a very specific group of judges, and it is pointless to show them to all comers.

As a competitor, you grow to know what judges are in harmony with your own eye for a dog and what judges don't agree.

When a judge can decide a win on preferred style, that means there are quality dogs in abundance because breed type comes first.

I have an appreciation for many styles of golden, although I might not want to breed that style myself. I am not at the level of master breeder in which I am originating a style all my own, though it is in my mind's eye . I have tremendous admiration for the master breeders who are at that level. Sometimes breeders will achieve a distinct style and thrive for a while, but then almost cartoon their dogs trying to maintain the look and line breeding.
I think I have heard, in other breeds, of some dogs becoming caricatures, but I've not seen it yet. I've heard a few breeders talking about how difficult it is to improve upon their dogs/lines without losing other parts (in particular they mentioned the head being very difficult to get back). I look forward to seeing more styles of dogs, thank you for you answer!
 

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This is a great thread, and a topic I have also tried to learn more about as well. There are a few breeders around me that all have different styles of goldens. One breeder has conformation bred dogs, heavy boned and big heads. You recognize those dogs when you see them out and about. Another breeder competes in agility and obedience and produces dogs finer boned, less coat, thinner heads with less stop, and I also can recognize her dogs around town.

Both breeders have conformation titles on their dogs so obviously they are breeding within standard, but I would consider both very different styles of goldens.

I have also heard others say that they "see the Quapaw" in my boy, and that Kathy has a definite style she produces. I think Denver looks much like his Dam's side too so I also see it.
 

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I think I have heard, in other breeds, of some dogs becoming caricatures, but I've not seen it yet. I've heard a few breeders talking about how difficult it is to improve upon their dogs/lines without losing other parts (in particular they mentioned the head being very difficult to get back). I look forward to seeing more styles of dogs, thank you for you answer!
My golden is conformation bred. His bone structure is large and his head is big and boxy. People comment on his looks which are quite different from the thin snout and lean bodied. His perfect weight is 100 pounds (veterinarian recommended).
 

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My golden is conformation bred. His bone structure is large and his head is big and boxy. People comment on his looks which are quite different from the thin snout and lean bodied. His perfect weight is 100 pounds (veterinarian recommended).
People comment on your boys features because the “generic” pet Goldens people see frequently out and about have a longer face, less bone and less breed type than a conformation bred golden, though 100lbs would definitely be considered oversized per the breed standard.

When people see a dog with a nice head, like conformation dogs have they’re often struck by the difference.
 

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People comment on your boys features because the “generic” pet Goldens people see frequently out and about have a longer face, less bone and less breed type than a conformation bred golden, though 100lbs would definitely be considered oversized per the breed standard.

When people see a dog with a nice head, like conformation dogs have they’re often struck by the difference.
I see a LOT of overdone/large GRs. It was one of the reasons I was avoiding GR for my family, I legit thought they were all 80-100 lb dogs. It wasn’t until I dig into the breed standard and started seeing with more “educated” eyes (educated for a layman, Lol) that I realized that most of the giant GRs I saw came from BYB

while I appreciate some “style”, I still think these giant fluffy, loose lipped, wrinkles headed, thick boned dogs are pretty far off of the breed standard, especially since GRs are purpose bred dogs
 

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Kate
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Sharing this with a smile.... :)

Both pictures are the same dog about a week apart.

This is an AKC pointed little man whose last show of 2020 before the dang shutdown got a major reserve (and seemed very close to getting that 4 point major).

Although those big boy good looks, coat, bone seem to visually add 10-25 pounds to him - according to people I've talked to.... he only weights 67 pounds.

I keep him lean because it's healthier for him. More weight on a dog = shorter active life for them. And possibly shorter life.

The coat is not an excess coat, btw. He's pretty moderate - but has an awesome thick undercoat. Makes my life easier when I get to show him.


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Sharing this with a smile.... :)

Both pictures are the same dog about a week apart.

This is an AKC pointed little man whose last show of 2020 before the dang shutdown got a major reserve (and seemed very close to getting that 4 point major).

Although those big boy good looks, coat, bone seem to visually add 10-25 pounds to him - according to people I've talked to.... he only weights 67 pounds.

I keep him lean because it's healthier for him. More weight on a dog = shorter active life for them. And possibly shorter life.

The coat is not an excess coat, btw. He's pretty moderate - but has an awesome thick undercoat. Makes my life easier when I get to show him.


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Wow!! That is a gorgeous dog :eek: I would never have guessed he weighs 67, his bone adds a lot of substance to him, but not in a bad way,I think he looks super balanced in these photos. Thank you for sharing!!
 

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Maegan
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100 lb for a conformation-bred Golden is 25 lb too heavy, so either the dog is way oversized or it's way overweight. Most of the conformation boys that I know weigh in the 68-72 lb range. Maybe 75 if they are at the top of the ideal height range.
 

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100 lb for a conformation-bred Golden is 25 lb too heavy, so either the dog is way oversized or it's way overweight. Most of the conformation boys that I know weigh in the 68-72 lb range. Maybe 75 if they are at the top of the ideal height range.
I agree Maegan. Some people don't realize it isn't just weight but height should be assessed as well. The dog may look fine and still be outside of breed standard.

Jules
 

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@Megora your dog is beautiful. I wish I could post pics of the dogs I’m referring to, but that would be pretty unfair of me, and would be taken out of context I’m sure.
 

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Sharing this with a smile.... :)

Both pictures are the same dog about a week apart.

This is an AKC pointed little man whose last show of 2020 before the dang shutdown got a major reserve (and seemed very close to getting that 4 point major).

Although those big boy good looks, coat, bone seem to visually add 10-25 pounds to him - according to people I've talked to.... he only weights 67 pounds.

I keep him lean because it's healthier for him. More weight on a dog = shorter active life for them. And possibly shorter life.

The coat is not an excess coat, btw. He's pretty moderate - but has an awesome thick undercoat. Makes my life easier when I get to show him.


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He’s gorgeous! There is nothing I love more than seeing a fit golden! People tell me all the time Denver is too skinny...he’s 68 pounds and is extremely fit. People just are used to seeing dogs with no waist and assume that is what Goldens are supposed to be built like.

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I agree that coat can be deceiving! I have myself described my boy as moderate, as he is not at the top of the standard. He is about 23.25-23.5 inches and 67 pounds and I prefer to keep him lean (we love obedience and are also trying our hand at agility; he is also AKC-Champion pointed). The standard for males is 23-24 inches and 65-75 pounds. Goldens are supposed to be athletes and sporting dogs. In the first two photos he is dry. My dog actually is not dripping in coat by any stretch, but he has some feathering. In the last, he is forlornly looking for his neighbor dog friend in the rain. 😂

Megora - your boys are gorgeous! Emmdenn - your boy is handsome and looks like he's the perfect weight.

I have seen a style of dog at non-AKC shows that is very heavy-flewed, almost newf-like, with more bone than I see on AKC dogs. This is sometimes rewarded, which is surprising only as the standard in that registry reads very similarly than the AKC standard. My understanding is that your golden is supposed to be a size able to be lifted in and out of a duck boat without tipping the boat (I don't lift my golden except in and out of an SUV for obedience, agility, or conformation classes, but if he was even a few pounds heavier, my back couldn't take it). ;) In all seriousness, the standard would suggest that they are not supposed to be 80+ dogs.


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I agree that coat can be deceiving! I have myself described my boy as moderate, as he is not at the top of the standard. He is about 23.25-23.5 inches and 67 pounds and I prefer to keep him lean (we love obedience and are also trying our hand at agility; he is also AKC-Champion pointed). The standard for males is 23-24 inches and 65-75 pounds. Goldens are supposed to be athletes and sporting dogs. In the first two photos he is dry. My dog actually is not dripping in coat by any stretch, but he has some feathering. In the last, he is forlornly looking for his neighbor dog friend in the rain. 😂

Megora - your boys are gorgeous!


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He's so handsome! He actually is exactly the same height and weight as Felix! I hope Fe matures out like your guy did, what a stunning man :love:
 

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Can I just say I’ve loved seeing all these fit young boys! All so handsome.
 

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58 lbs ( girlie); 77lbs (boy)
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Maegan
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Thanks for posting a girl @Ljilly28 , but can we get some more girl photos on here?!? Eevee is the top of the ideal height range for females and weighs 65 lb. She's not small, but if you put her next to a dog of similar size, you can tell which is the male and which is the female - as it's supposed to be.
This was her from back in June.
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I don't consider her to be a moderate dog, but she's not overdone by any means. On the style topic, I'm not sure that she's really any one style or other, but she's also not generic (if I do say so myself lol). She's from an outcrossed litter, so she's a combination of two or three different styles.
 

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We have a bitch puppy at home and I’ll be interested to see what size she ends up being. Her dam is 58 pounds, sire is 65 pounds.
 

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I was thinking the same thing Maegan. I see these boys with bigger coats (which I do love) and I don't think Maggie will ever have that heavy of a coat. I don't show her so I am actually pleased she doesn't have a heavier coat, easier for me to groom and keep up on vacuuming :) Not a super picture but you can see she has a bit of coat. I wonder if she will fill out more as she is not quite 2? 20200522_183245.jpg
 

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I was thinking the same thing Maegan. I see these boys with bigger coats (which I do love) and I don't think Maggie will ever have that heavy of a coat. I don't show her so I am actually pleased she doesn't have a heavier coat, easier for me to groom and keep up on vacuuming :) Not a super picture but you can see she has a bit of coat. I wonder if she will fill out more as she is not quite 2? View attachment 876791
Maggie may fill out some more as she gets older. I expect Eevee to fill out even more than she already has, so she may end up a little heavier than 65 lb at full maturity and in "hard working condition", but it will be mostly muscle at that point. She's more filled out now than she is in that photo. Most bitches struggle with having a ton of coat because they shed with their cycles. Eevee has been getting weekly baths for the last 3 months, which has helped her to grow more coat, but she all of sudden starting shedding like crazy 2.5 weeks ago and came in season within about 2 days of me noticing an abnormal amount of hair flying off her when I was blow drying. Thankfully she didn't blow all of that nice new coat that has grown in over the last 3 months. LOL Some bitches keep their feathering when they blow coat, some shed undercoat and feathering, and then there are others that keep their full coat all the time.
 
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This is my girl Sayer ( AM CH Pebwin Reverie Soothsayer CGC) she is 57 lbs. She is one of my 3 look-alike Mystic daughters.
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