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Just heard about the ongoing study (20 years) of rhesus monkeys that found monkeys on a calorie restricted diet not only lived longer, but had less disease! Apparently this has been studied in many animals (mice, labs, etc) although the other studies did not conclude possible less disease.

But I can't help but wonder....could this be a possibility to help the golden breed? Live longer, less cancer? I know there are no definitive answers, but wouldn't it be cool to do a long term study on it for our golden retrievers?

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/07/09/health/main5146924.shtml

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/04/070419160140.htm

http://www.resveratrol.info/2009/07/resveratrol-mimics-caloric-restriction-in-animals/
 

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I don't know about the cancer connection, but one of my Vets told me he would rather my dogs be underweight than overweight. Shadow was always very thin. Thin to the point were it concerned me. He told me he was far better off than many other dogs.

This Vet also worked on the Human Genome Project. I like him a lot.
 

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est.1989
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whats up with this?????????

I had a disturbing email this am from one of my puppy purchasers (Kiss's littermate)

SNIP: My vet has asked me to use the ratio of 1 cup of food per 10 pounds of puppy. She is 42 pounds. She gets 4 cups of food a day.

so if she follows this @ maturity she shall be eating approx 6 c per day:confused: for a 60 # female :uhoh:

Kiss is no where near 42lbs and eats 3 cups per day --perfect weight in my opinion!

I think a clause needs to be added to my contract, if you disregard my advice and follow your vets, let them warranty your puppy!!!!!! MY VENT for the day!!!!!!!!!
 

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I had a disturbing email this am from one of my puppy purchasers (Kiss's littermate)

SNIP: My vet has asked me to use the ratio of 1 cup of food per 10 pounds of puppy. She is 42 pounds. She gets 4 cups of food a day.

so if she follows this @ maturity she shall be eating approx 6 c per day:confused: for a 60 # female :uhoh:

Kiss is no where near 42lbs and eats 3 cups per day --perfect weight in my opinion!

I think a clause needs to be added to my contract, if you disregard my advice and follow your vets, let them warranty your puppy!!!!!! MY VENT for the day!!!!!!!!!

Wow... and we wonder why there are sooo many overweight pets these days!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I don't know about the cancer connection, but one of my Vets told me he would rather my dogs be underweight than overweight. Shadow was always very thin. Thin to the point were it concerned me. He told me he was far better off than many other dogs.

This Vet also worked on the Human Genome Project. I like him a lot.
Definitely you don't know, but it makes one wonder (me anyway). Definitely more testing should be done, but from the rhesus monkey study

"The calorie-cut monkeys had less than half the incidence of cancerous tumors or heart disease as the monkeys who ate normally"
 

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But vets are Gods and breeders "idiots" !!!!!!!!!!!:curtain:
Oh geez, don't even go there. :no: My sis is in vet school and she gets insensed at the notion of me asking my breeder (or other breeders) for veterinary advice. But then some of the things she tells about her classmates? And they are going to be vets in a few years? Yikes!
 

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est.1989
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Oh geez, don't even go there. :no: My sis is in vet school and she gets insensed at the notion of me asking my breeder (or other breeders) for veterinary advice. But then some of the things she tells about her classmates? And they are going to be vets in a few years? Yikes!
sorry!!!!! vets get about how many hrs on nutrition in vet school? then they toot the horns of companies that supplement their practices??? As a nurse I know that "hands on experience" is more valuable than what any text-book teaches us...so our multiple years of breeding/raising dogs/puppies + numerous hours of our own research + trial and error has to count for something ... I know my males don't even eat 6 cups of food per day so why would I welcome that direction from any veterinarian :confused:

ps...how many vets have even whelped a litter when we take our precious bitches in to them having complications??
 

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There was a stage where Jax ate 1 cup/10 pounds a couple of months ago, and before that, he ate even more than that. Now that he's 50ish, he's still on 4 cups, though. If the vet isn't a complete idiot, perhaps that ratio only applied to a particular life stage.

As far as feed less/live longer, the Purina study on healthy weight made it pretty clear that lean dogs lived almost two years longer than even mildly obese dogs, and they experienced a delay of almost two years of the onset of geriatric and chronic diseases to boot.

I won't be surprised if the research eventually shows that certain cancers show up less often in lean dogs. Being overweight affects immune function, lymph function, inflammatory processes, etc. mostly for the negative.
 

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I know for adult dogs I was given a 10 calories per every pound we wanted Tucker to weigh. For him this is the right ratio. Shadow would be sickly on this amount of food. He needs so many more calories than Tucker does.
 

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There was a stage where Jax ate 1 cup/10 pounds a couple of months ago, and before that, he ate even more than that. Now that he's 50ish, he's still on 4 cups, though. If the vet isn't a complete idiot, perhaps that ratio only applied to a particular life stage.
This could be the case and maybe the puppy parent misunderstood. Maybe the amount the vet recommended was just for a certain growth period. I remember Cooper as a pup was eating 6 cups per day at one point but then the amount was gradually reduced down to 5 then 4 then 3 cups per day. He now eats 2.5 cups of Orijen per day as an active adult.
 

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as a multiple dog owner/breeder, I can honestly say that I have NEVER had a puppy eat 4 cups a day. In my puppy packet I recommend 3/4-1 cup per meal x 3 @ 8 wks. Cutting out the noon feed @ 12 wks and dividing the amt into 2 meals...All my girl eat up to 3 cups per day, from 5 mos to 9 yrs ...The older girls are now down to roughly 2.75 c per day....Even Blue who is growing right now, and a very active 16 month old male is getting approx 4.5 cups!!!!!

to date I have not had one with a hip/elbow problem that have been home grown! Yes I am knocking on wood! I'll stick to my protocol, If it ain't broke I don't fix it!!!!!
 

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Puppy foods very a great deal in caloric density, volume may not be the best way to compare.
I strongly agree. Talking about 1 cup of food per 10 lbs. of body weight is pointless. For example, Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream is 360 kcal/cup compared to EVO at 537 kcal/cup. I have to wonder about any vet who would talk generically about "cups per body weight".
 

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Out of curiousity,

What constitues a cup? We feed Yogi using a measuring cup. It's 8 ounces per meal twice a day. I was always under the impression that 8 oz = 1 cup.

So generally I say that we feed him 2 cups per day. However I always read everybody feeding ther Goldens slightly more than that. He's not as lean as I would of hoped either. He has a naturally stocky build.
 

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Very interesting discussion, I used to feed maple according to the instructions on the bag, what i got from this is a dog who was about 12-15 pounds overweight two months ago, We stopped by the vet today and she is down 5 1/2 pounds so we are happy about that. I had been feeding her the acana lamb and apple because she has a chicken allergy (most likely) before this and she was thrilled with it at first but was iffy with it by august around the time of her check up, vet wanted to put her on their medical light or whatever it is at the vet and I said no i wasn't comfortable with that, so I did agree to get the light and fit version of the acana, she was not happy and the itchy paws came back due to the chicken (most likely). So I was talking to the lady that I may get our second friend from and she said her first recommendation was raw but if I wasn't comfortable with that then go with orijen, she said not to be afraid to ignore the instructions on the bag, 2 cups a day is fine until she reaches her healthy size and then go from there, she said she varies it day by day, if someone is feeling a little chunky they get a little less and if they are a tad skinny they get a bonus!

Today I picked up a bag of the farm fresh pet foods grain free beef raw patties, I was thinking I would try doing 1 cup orijen red and one patty a day every second day and see how it goes.
 

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It's true for humans, so I would think it would translate to dogs as well (especially considering the research we already have on animals).

As far as weight control/feeding in adult dogs, someone on here recommended the 10 calories/pound for weight loss and that worked really well for Holden. We chose a high protein, grain-free food, fed smaller, more frequent meals, and supplemented green beans when we needed to "fill him up." We now keep him between 1200-1300 calories on light activity days and 1500-1600 on heavy activity days. This is slightly less than his calculated needs, but it's what works for him. He's been at a constant 68-70 lbs for the past two years, which should be just about perfect for him considering his dad was 75 lbs and Holden has a slightly more slender frame than his sire.
 

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I think Cody is at the prefect tummy size right now, although it is my maternal instinct to want to fatten him up, lo
He is 83lbs and eats 4 cups of the large breed Adult Wellness Super5mix.

They always say skinny dogs live longer, and as long as you don't cross that line for too skinny they are so much better off.
 

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Seems like common sense to me, for human and animals. BTW my aquarium fish live for YEARS AND YEARS- even the little cheap ones that aren't "supposed to" and I only feed them once a week (plus they have live plants to nibble on). My theory there is it keeps the water cleaner, less waste, but it works. I have had little tropical fish and Bettas live for five plus years. So, different reasoning to the dogs and people. But still, we're a society obsessed with fat = healthy.
 
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