[goldenlover17]

Hi,
I'm new here and tried looking around to see if anyone else has encountered this issue before. I put down a deposit last weekend on a golden retriever puppy from a breeder that I met with and liked. She provided me with an overview of the process in advance that stated that the purchase price was $2000 and a $500 non-refundable deposit was required to guarantee me a puppy. The document never stated that there any additional costs that i would be required to pay nor did she mention these at all when I went and visited. I asked a lot of questions and felt comfortable with her.

I just got a package in the mail from them with a deposit receipt and more information that included a few things that I was shocked about and not sure how to handle.
1. The information now says that I have to pay $20 to register the puppy with AKC
2. I also have to pay for the required microchipping at $25.50
3. I have to pay $15/day if I don't pick up the puppy on the day she specifies and pay $20 vaccination fee & vet bill if not picked up by 9 weeks

The initial document she provided me prior to my giving the deposit said:
Purchase Price was $2000. They complete the microchipping and AKC registration themselves. And the puppy normally comes home between 8-10 weeks. There were no disclaimers or statements that additional charges apply.

I looked online and see that she has to register the entire litter and each puppy and it only costs $25 plus $2 a puppy.

Is adding these costs in extra over and above the purchase price normal? I don't feel like I should accept them, they weren't disclosed to me up front and the AKC registration cost seems ridiculously high compared to what her costs will be. The whole $15/day isn't likely a big deal because I don't anticipate an issue picking the puppy up, but there are just too many charges being added on that I don't feel she should be allowed to do after the fact. I don't want to jepordize a good relationship with them, because they are picking the puppies that go home with each family.

I know in the end, the total amount of money is only $45, but it just doesn't seem right. Anyone reading the documents she provided would have assumed those costs were part of the purchase price. I feel like she's taking advantage of the buyer. Any thoughts anyone can provide?

 

[LibertyME]

It seems rather ballsy and a bit tacky to nickle and dime you to death after youve spent 2K on a puppy.
Maybe it is just me??

 

[Sterling Archer]

It seems rather ballsy and a bit tacky to nickle and dime you to death after youve spent 2K on a puppy.
Maybe it is just me??

x2. I think that's pretty nervy. If the dog isn't ready or she has to change dates with you...do you get a refund? I know the deposit is supposedly non-refundable...but I'd ask for it back. tell her that if she doesn't, you'll consult your lawyer (fib) about the fees that she failed to disclose prior to taking your deposit (which you made in good faith...assuming a final purchase price of $2,000).

 

[LibertyME]

any chance this breeder is from Maine?

 

[GoldenCamper]

It seems rather ballsy and a bit tacky to nickle and dime you to death after youve spent 2K on a puppy.
Maybe it is just me??

I find that awfully tacky too. I know I would be put off with a "oh by the way I want another 45 bucks on top of your 2 grand":no:

 

[Megora]

I guess it depends...

1. The information now says that I have to pay $20 to register the puppy with AKC

- This is not an issue. Everyone who buys a puppy from a breeder is required to pay to register their puppy. Most breeders don't really pressure new owners to fill out the registration papers, which is a pity. Because then the dogs don't ever get registered.

2. I also have to pay for the required microchipping at $25.50

- I can bet this is just to register the microchip in your name/address. If it's not and you still have to pay $20 to register the chip, then yeah that'd bother me.

3. I have to pay $15/day if I don't pick up the puppy on the day she specifies and pay $20 vaccination fee & vet bill if not picked up by 9 weeks

- This seems a bit different and does bother me a little bit. Not so much the vaccination, because I think you will be paying more than that at the vet while following the vaccination schedule. But I've never had a breeder talk about charging me for things like having to leave the puppy with them a little bit longer.

Purchase Price was $2000. They complete the microchipping and AKC registration themselves. And the puppy normally comes home between 8-10 weeks. There were no disclaimers or statements that additional charges apply.

What I'm asking you is if the breeder is going to be filling out the registration form for you and mailing it in to the AKC + filling out the microchip form for your and mailing or faxing it in to the chip company for you.

Something I'm thinking is that probably they should have spelled it out that those services were not included in the purchase price for the puppy, and they weren't taking money out of their own pocket to take care of it for you.

Now if you are quibbling about spending $2000 on a puppy, then depending on who the breeder is, you can probably quibble about spending THAT MUCH when you might have purchased a puppy for a lot less.

4 years ago I spent $900 for my guy. Decent enough breeder. I mailed in my own registration paper with the required $20. Microchip was $18 and I faxed that in.

 

[golden_eclipse]

Is this a show puppy? (2k seems like a lot for a pet puppy). I guess it happens, but that price is almost a red flag, plus all the nickel and dime-ing, seems sketchy.

 

[HiTideGoldens]

I honestly don’t see a problem with a boarding fee if the puppy isn’t picked up by a certain date. That seems reasonable to me. With the other stuff though, if it were me and it were my litter (I am not a breeder though) I would just include the AKC registration and microchip costs in the price of the puppy (i.e. the $2000 includes the registration and microchipping). It just seems much easier than ticking off your puppy buyers.

I understand the desire to want all puppies chipped and registered, it probably just should have been disclosed up front that there was an additional cost involved with those items.

$2000 is on the high end in some parts of the country but normal in others (like California where I live) if the puppy is out of finished parents with all health clearances. That in and of itself is not a red flag at all to me. I don't think this breeder seems sketchy or not sketchy based on the information provided (which is minimal)... perhaps they just didn't realize the additional costs would leave a bad taste in people's mouths.

 

[Megora]

With the other stuff though, if it were me and it were my litter (I am not a breeder though) I would just include the AKC registration and microchip costs in the price of the puppy (i.e. the $2000 includes the registration and microchipping). It just seems much easier than ticking off your puppy buyers.

But do breeders normally do that?

I always thought you get a packet when you pick up your puppy and it contains all the paperwork you have to fill out and send in?

 

[Loisiana]

I agree that if they want the owner to pay them for those things, just include it in your original asking price. And personally I'd be put off by someone charging me extra to pick up my puppy a few days later. It's like saying you can't wait to get these critters out of your hair and out of your life. But that's just me. Many of the breeders I know will board the dogs they have bred free of charge for life.

 

[HiTideGoldens]

But do breeders normally do that?

I always thought you get a packet when you pick up your puppy and it contains all the paperwork you have to fill out and send in?

I've heard of breeders doing it that way. When you pick up the puppy you fill out the paperwork and then the breeder sends it in to make sure that the litter is registered.

 

[LibertyME]

If it is important to the breeder...Wouldnt it be nice if, at the kitchen table during pickup, the breeder helped the puppy buyers fill out the AKC & chip paperwork? Then the breeder could write the checks for each, put the stamp on the envelope and mailed it in.
Breeder gets what they want...puppy people get the help and encouragement they often need without being told "oh by the way...surprise! You need to pay for this too!" ?

 

[HiTideGoldens]

And personally I'd be put off by someone charging me extra to pick up my puppy a few days later. It's like saying you can't wait to get these critters out of your hair and out of your life. But that's just me. Many of the breeders I know will board the dogs they have bred free of charge for life.

A few days, sure. Usually weird things are there for a reason. Like (as an example) there was a warning on a superman costume I saw that the costume wouldn’t make you fly. Obviously it was there because some idiot thought the cape would make him fly. Maybe this breeder had people who wanted to pick the puppy up at 12 weeks because it was more convenient timing for them and they ended up boarding and training the puppy for much longer than they anticipated...there's probably a reason it's there. I also understand the charge for the vaccination and vet visit if the puppy buyer elects to pick up the puppy later as well.

I wouldn’t expect any breeder to board a dog for free ever. In an emergency situation, ok. But any of my friends would do that for us, not just our dogs’ breeders. If we were just going on vacation or something I would always pay someone, no matter who it was.

 

[HiTideGoldens]

If it is important to the breeder...Wouldnt it be nice if, at the kitchen table during pickup, the breeder helped the puppy buyers fill out the AKC & chip paperwork? Then the breeder could write the checks for each, put the stamp on the envelope and mailed it in.
Breeder gets what they want...puppy people get the help and encouragement they often need without being told "oh by the way...surprise! You need to pay for this too!" ?

I completely agree. I think the problem in this situation is the appearance of nickle and diming and the lack of communication with the puppy buyer.

 

[goldenlover17]

Thanks for all the replies. The breeder is Windy Ridges out of Flemington, NJ. The price is comparable to breeders in the area. I think overall, I'm just shocked that the additional charges aren't included in the purchase price of the dog and it leaves me feeling conned, like now they're adding on more money, trying to nickle & dime me to death. The fact that they didn't disclose any of this before I put my deposit down is what I'm upset about. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks this is wrong of them to do. Now I have to decide my next steps. I think the biggest issue for me is the AKC registration, I don't care if my puppy is registered, but I believe she is required to be. So if it's a requirement for them to do it, they should be paying for it.

The last golden I got was 10 years ago, but all of this was included in the purchase price.

 

[HiTideGoldens]

I don’t think it’s fraud. Not at all. That’s getting a little dramatic, IMO. I would be very careful about accusing a breeder of fraud on the internet...especially when you just named them. It just could have been communicated better, THAT is the issue. Breeders aren't perfect and they're still human, they don't do everything exactly right all the time. These are things you were going to pay for anyway so maybe just nicely communicate to the breeder that in the future they should consider notifying the puppy buyers up front so they aren’t surprised like you were.

 

[Megora]

The fact that they didn't disclose any of this before I put my deposit down is close to fraud. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks this is wrong of them to do. Now I have to decide my next steps. I think the biggest issue for me is the AKC registration, I don't care if my puppy is registered, but I believe she is required to be. So if it's a requirement for them to do it, they should be paying for it.

I mean no offense here, but a lot of us on GRF have other issues with breeders cutting corners or schlepping when it comes to how they breed, why they breed, how responsible they are as far as clearances and care for their dogs, etc.

The fault here is a failure to communicate or spell out exactly what is included in the price and what isn't.

There is another thread on GRF where a member was upset because a breeder was pressuring her to send in the registration forms to the AKC. She was upset about spending $20 on something she didn't even care about. My reaction at the time is the same one I have now.

Each one of our dogs came from different breeders. Each breeder handed us a packet or folder full of paperwork that needed filling out, sending in, and paying for. This included AKC registration - which costs $20. The longer you wait, the more expensive it gets to register your dog. So $20 is cheap.

That $2000 is the price for the puppy. I'm going to give your breeder the benefit of the doubt and assume that is a small fraction of what it cost her to produce your puppy and care for it for the first 8 weeks of its life. And it's a small fraction of what went into the breeding itself.

 

[Golden999]

I think your first warning flag was the $2,000 purchase price. That tells me this is someone doing it as a business taking a nice big profit margin on each puppy. No one can tell me that feeding a puppy for the first eight weeks of it's life costs anything like $2,000- no matter what food they're using.

Anyhow, I don't know what can be done now that you've already put a deposit down. Call them and raise hell over the extra fees, I guess. But in the end, if they won't back down, and they won't refund your $500, I don't know what you can do.

Live and learn, though, I guess. Next time, after your dog is grown and lived a nice long full life and dies in his sleep from old age, when you're looking for a puppy again, beware of people charging outrageous prices with lots of strings attached. My puppy only cost $300 total, no deposit, no strings, and he's a great pet. I even had to borrow that and it took me a year to pay off, but it was worth it.

 

[HiTideGoldens]

NO. NO, $2000 is NOT A RED FLAG. Can we move past that part of it? Good grief.

 

[Shalva]

I don't think its ballsy at all and its very much how I do things..

I charge for hte puppy ...
then when you come to pick up the puppy I ask you to bring other checks.

I ask you to bring a check for the AKC for registration... (some breeders send the registration papers home with you so you can fill them out and send them in... I prefer to make sure they are done correctly and send them in myself, it is the same money)

I ask you to bring a check for the microchip (some breeders send the papers home and tell yo uto fill it out and send the check in yourself, again I prefer to do it myself to be sure it is done)

and yes if you don't pick up your puppy at the scheduled time then sorry I have to pay for another set of shots and another vet visit and food etc etc... all things that again you would have to pay for anyway...

for me the paperwork is something I do because I want to be sure the registered names are done correctly and that the puppies all end up being registered the way I want them registered ie. limited or full as well as the registered names written correctly... by my doing it and sending them in I make sure that they are done right and people send in the paperwork... it doesn't cost you any more because you would have to send in the paperwork and write the check anyway... its just by my doing it I make sure its done... the microchip is exaclty the same I do it so I can make sure that the chips are registered and sent in... if I sent the paperwork with you, you would still have to send it in and write the check.. its just I do it so I can make sure its done... we sit at the table and do it together.

as far as the board.... I have never had to do that... and within a week or two is fine with me... I have held puppies for folks before but if I have to take pup to the vet or start housebreaking and training and pay for food (especially as I feed raw) then if you go much over a week or two then yeah it starts costing me money.
just my two cents