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Golden RetrieveEnthusiast
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33 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I joined this forum back in April and have been been posting, sharing pictures, and commenting on threads. At the same time I joined I had a discussion with an administrator about my website that I wanted to include in my signature that shares my thoughts on Golden Retrievers.

The other day I posted an article that I thought the forum would enjoy and was attacked by some forum members basing my website, accusing me of posting fake pictures of my dog, saying I was breeding puppies, saying my only reason for being on the forum was to promote my site, and generally just being very hostile for no particular reason.

I am entitled to my opinions, have just as much right as anyone else to be a member of this forum, and the basic human right to be treated with respect and dignity. I ask that moderators quit removing my signature and make some effort to control the culture of this forum. I understand not being able to control the masses but in general I get the impression that the culture here discourages new members and anyone with a different opinion. If it were my site I would want it to be a welcoming place that encouraged growth.

Brad
 

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Matt
Joined
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235 Posts
I joined this forum back in April and have been been posting, sharing pictures, and commenting on threads. At the same time I joined I had a discussion with an administrator about my website that I wanted to include in my signature that shares my thoughts on Golden Retrievers.

I am entitled to my opinions, have just as much right as anyone else to be a member of this forum, and the basic human right to be treated with respect and dignity. I ask that moderators quit removing my signature and make some effort to control the culture of this forum. I understand not being able to control the masses but in general I get the impression that the culture here discourages new members and anyone with a different opinion. If it were my site I would want it to be a welcoming place that encouraged growth.

Brad
Just for all to know, and to end any disputes, Admin (Yung) has decided to remove the signature. Any information needed on Golden Retrievers can be found here on GRF, that was submitted by all our members.

Case closed?
 

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Premium Member
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18,015 Posts
I would like to know what criteria and reasoning went into the decision to remove the signature. Will links to other sites also be prohibited?

For instance, I have a link to Golden Retriever Rescue of North Texas in my signature; multiple other members have links to other rescue organizations in their signature, Tippykayak and others have links to personal blogs or photo sites in their signatures.

What links in signature blocks are allowed and what type of links are not allowed?
 

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Registered
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4,345 Posts
I would like to know what criteria and reasoning went into the decision to remove the signature. Will links to other sites also be prohibited?
GRF promotes responsible breeding, without which, our breed would fall apart. The reason I totally agree with his signature being removed, (although it's now back :confused:), is because the site he links to has Golden pups for sale from questionable breeders.

We get a lot of lurkers that visit and they will unwittingly go to his site and believe that the breeders, since they were linked from GRF, they must be reputable. Not saying everyone will feel this way or be duped, but if even one person is led to purchase one of these pups, we, as a forum, have failed at providing the best information and resources on the breed we love.

That is why his siggy, at least the link, should not be allowed, IMO.
 

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Inactive
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11,326 Posts
I would like to know what criteria and reasoning went into the decision to remove the signature. Will links to other sites also be prohibited?

For instance, I have a link to Golden Retriever Rescue of North Texas in my signature; multiple other members have links to other rescue organizations in their signature, Tippykayak and others have links to personal blogs or photo sites in their signatures.

What links in signature blocks are allowed and what type of links are not allowed?
It's the for-profit nature of his site that makes his link break the rules about personal promotion and linking to sales-oriented websites. Those of us that link to personal sites that don't make us money aren't breaking the rule.

I demonstrated, rather amply, in his other thread, that some, if not all, of his articles were plagiarized and that he lied and told us that they were original and written by him and, in his words, people he has hired. He then started this thread to claim that he was attacked unfairly, but he has yet to address the fact that his site is full of ripped-off, inaccurate articles used to sell ad space and clickthroughs to sales sites. He also hasn't addressed the fact that he told a blatant lie to the forum. I suppose that's what he means when he says he was attacked "for no reason."

He's using this forum to generate views for his site and to bump up his search rankings. That's totally different than linking to a charity or to a personal site that doesn't provide financial benefit to the poster.

Over and over again, the community and the mods have agreed that personal promotion for money, whether you sell directly from your site, whether you're begging for money for yourself, or whether you're selling ad views, goes against the interests of the forum. The message is clear: don't use us to make money for yourself.
 

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Inactive
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11,326 Posts
For the record, there's no reason to believe that he's lying about the pictures he posted here of a light Golden that he says is his dog, and I don't see anywhere on his site where he's breeding or brokering puppies. Apparently there was a link to a broker at one point, but he appears to have removed it.

However, his site is full of pictures that are not his. Most (perhaps all?) of the pictures are simply from a Google Image Search for "Golden Retriever." They're just as ripped off and used with attribution as the content of the articles is.

My guess is that he really does own a Golden and he really does like the breed. I don't even care that he's trying to monetize that interest. I do care that he's deceiving the members of this forum in order to try to make some money, and I do care that the rule about profit-driven links in signatures is observed.
 

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Registered
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3,676 Posts
Your original signature - the one that admin removed - stated that any and all feedback on your site was greatly appreciated. Pointing out the inaccuracies and incomplete information that you are trying to promote as a resource for those researching golden retriever breeders is not hostility. It's honesty. And it's presented out of love for this breed and a desire to be part of the solution when it comes to guiding people to reputable breeders and rescues for their pet buying needs.

You are entitled to your opinions. I simply very strongly suggested that you label them as such on your website instead of pretending to be an expert in a breed you have demonstrated that you know very little about. I also feel it does a horrible injustice to this forum to have a link to this site positioned in such a way that it makes it look like you run GRF. It's unfair to the folks who stumble upon your site and will take this well developed community as a sign that you know what you're talking about. And it's unfair to the breeders, breed enthusiasts and kind folks who have contributed to the vast knowledge base of this forum. That's my feedback.

Julie, Jersey and Oz
 

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Registered
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4,836 Posts
Frustration is right.... " The incidence of cancer in English Goldens is much lower"....uh really? No mention of elbow clearances.....etc etc etc And linking to this forum as a tab on the site? Jersey's Mom is right, it makes it look as though this forum is part of that website...not cool. I wish I hadn't looked at the site either.
 

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Registered
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10,950 Posts
I agree with Tippkayak:

"He's using this forum to generate views for his site and to bump up his search rankings."

With that said, the Internet is a free-for-all. It's not ours to control or moderate. Only thing we can do is make there is no implied endorsement by this GRF and its members of this site. Asking him to not promote it here is a reasonable request.
 

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Golden RetrieveEnthusiast
Joined
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33 Posts
Either one of two things are going one.

1. There is a double standard which is people liked by the forums can link to their personal websites

or

2. People reviewing my website focus way more on the ads then the actual content

If you look at the structure of my website it is setup to guide readers through a process of learning about the breed. Take for example my article on dog health problems . This article hits the high points of selecting a good breeder and common things to look out for. Then in big bold letters it tells the reader to learn more and links to 9 more articles that dig in common health concerns in more detail.

It is ludacris to think that a single page on my website should cover everything a person needs to know. That is why it is a site with over 100 pages and not a book for sell. I have no delusions that someone will read every single article on my site before buying a Golden Retriever but at the same time I don't provide any links to buy a puppy, recommend a breeder, or offer any kind of official positions. I give my readers information to think about and knowledge to go out and learn more. I imagine I'm one of many websites that people reader when learning about goldens.

As for the ads on my site, as I have said before, these are rendered by Google and the ads selected are the ones Google feels are most appropriate. Having ads on my site does not mean I'm promoting products, services, have a sales oriented site, or only using it for profit. While I'm typing this I see a ad for Xfinity right above the quick reply box. Does that mean this forum recommends Comcast for my television needs? Is this site a "for profit" site that should not be linked to from anywhere online? No its just a way of trying to ad value to the site by offering ads to serve up things people may be looking for.
 

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Administrator
Joined
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16,472 Posts
The admin that oversees this board, and other pet forums, as well as the company he works for have decided they do not want your link posted here. Any information needed to be looked up from members here for Golden Retrievers can be found here. This also applies to links to other Golden Retriever message boards that are not allowed to be linked here.
 

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Where The Bitches Rule
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6,429 Posts
There was a time when GRF had ads from Google that many of us went CRAZY over - irresponsible breeders and puppy brokers. The admin worked with Google and had any and all ads referring to breeders and brokers of dogs blocked from running on this site. Maybe you could do the same, that would likely ease some of the angst with that part of the ad. As for the articles on your site, I have not read them, but if you truly have a passion for this breed go to the GRCA and GRCC and read what they have to say on their websites and then reconsider what you have posted on your website.
 

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Premium Member
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7,788 Posts
The admin that oversees this board, and other pet forums, as well as the company he works for have decided they do not want your link posted here. Any information needed to be looked up from members here for Golden Retrievers can be found here. This also applies to links to other Golden Retriever message boards that are not allowed to be linked here.
Can you provide a bit more clarification about policy regarding links to external websites, please? It seems very broad as stated, though I think I understand the reason.

If we are forbidden to cite information outside the GRF, a lot of valuable information will be lost. For example, I have posted a lot of links to reference sites that provide information about canine seizures and some to news sites. Is that acceptable? Are there categories of external sites that are welcome and others that are not?

Thank you,
Lucy
 

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Administrator
Joined
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16,472 Posts
Can you provide a bit more clarification about policy regarding links to external websites, please? It seems very broad as stated, though I think I understand the reason.

If we are forbidden to cite information outside the GRF, a lot of valuable information will be lost. For example, I have posted a lot of links to reference sites that provide information about canine seizures and some to news sites. Is that acceptable? Are there categories of external sites that are welcome and others that are not?

Thank you,
Lucy
Those kinds of sites are fine. I believe they just do not want sites being linked here that use us to drawl members to them for reasons more than just referencing.
 

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Tracer, Rumor & Cady
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10,683 Posts
Im not a computer programmer, but I think I can understand why you *might* want to have access to the nearly 20,000 GRF membership as an audience for your website!

You have a free membership here <just like me> you mimic information...ask GRF membership help you edit pages <which they generously have done!>...and voila! post them to your site! Personally, its a bit too insincere for me.

You see it bothers me that you didnt find it important to become a part of the membership..... to invest your time and energy getting to know anyone here....Not to mention mourning with them as they lose their much-loved pets...rejoice with anyone that is bringing home a puppy....celebrate training victories...and encourage anyone as they work with their dog through training issues...

Many of us have been here for YEARS....Not only have we seen this site grow & change, add advertisers, but we have also seen members marry, watched each others human babies grow, graduate high school and go on to college. We have had many passionate debates, hurt feelings, misunderstandings, mended friendships. We have cheered on members with very serious illnesses and together mourned the death of members.

When someone <you are not the first!> comes on all he!!-a-fire claiming to want to be "the one" to "educate" the public on any number of issues ... I personally find it a bit...insincere. Stick around if you choose...invest not necessarily money, but your time... Develop YOUR own opinions...come to YOUR own conclusions...put YOUR own thoughts into your site. If people find kinship there, find a place where they can relate to what you have written then you will have something you can be proud of.
 
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