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A friend referred us to this breeder, Oceans Breeze in Arlington VT

They seem to be new at it? and have limited akc dogs. When searching their name on k9data and also the ofa site I'm not finding much. the breeders names are Sharon Gratton or Patricia McKee.

Their current litters mom name is Apple. Not sure who the sire is. I'm assuming this is a backyard breeder? If they do breed with all clearances then I'll move forward. I've asked for info but have no response yet...Was just wondering if anyone on this site has any info on them or any dogs from their kennel
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
ok. just heard from the owner. they do not have OFA's on the parents b/c they don't " believe" in them. Went on to say 1 dog they had, had their X-rays sent in 2x for hips, 1 came back good the other came back fail. So they think OFA's are unreliable

Also told me how 90% of hip dysplasia is owner related from food and too much exercise? I would not be able to live with myself knowing we have a dog with parents where the dice was rolled...& if something ended up happening I would be kicking myself.

With OFA's being such simple and cost efficient tests, WHY would breeders NOT do them??
 

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With OFA's being such simple and cost efficient tests, WHY would breeders NOT do them??
Look, in the population of Goldens with generation after generation of hip clearances from OFA, devastating hip dysplasia is VERY RARE. You may have a dog come back borderline or mild but rare is the 10 month old puppy needing $3000 hip surgery. This is the population of show dogs or performance/hunting-bred Goldens from responsible breeders. Peer pressure is VERY HIGH to ALWAYS clear dogs before breeding. We have GREATLY REDUCED the incidence of severe hip dysplasia.

In the population of backyard bred newspaper dogs, the incidences of severe or quality of life reducing hip dysplasia is MUCH HIGHER. If they don't test they simply don't know what they have. It is HARDER to find a dog that will pass.

So why don't breeders like this do OFAs? #1 the cost...it's at least $500 per dog to get it done. And you have to do it before you ever get a dime from a sold puppy.
#2 : It's hard to see your pet fail something. It's a big bitter pill to swallow. It dashes all of your plans of breeding them. It's much easier to blame an institution that has evaluated hundreds of thousands of dogs than to cull the dogs in your breeding program and put your money where your mouth is. IOW : It's ignorance and apathy. Two driving forces of all backyard breeding.
 

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This is a strictly for profit breeder. No clearances. Excuses for not doing the right thing. Run away. Poor Apple...bred before she was two...then bred back 6 months later. Breaks my heart. This breeder is not reputable. Possibly the dog who failed the hip test was her male...
 

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ok. just heard from the owner. they do not have OFA's on the parents b/c they don't " believe" in them. Went on to say 1 dog they had, had their X-rays sent in 2x for hips, 1 came back good the other came back fail. So they think OFA's are unreliable

Also told me how 90% of hip dysplasia is owner related from food and too much exercise? I would not be able to live with myself knowing we have a dog with parents where the dice was rolled...& if something ended up happening I would be kicking myself.

With OFA's being such simple and cost efficient tests, WHY would breeders NOT do them??

If I'm not mistaken, OFA won't re-evaluate hips or elbows. Once you fail, you fail. So right off the bat, I'm not sure she is being honest.
 

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If I'm not mistaken, OFA won't re-evaluate hips or elbows. Once you fail, you fail. So right off the bat, I'm not sure she is being honest.
They will...very often positioning can mean the difference between a fair and a good...or a single hip being rated as grade 1 while the other hip is fine. It is common to wait three months for a new panel. Then do a new set of xrays and send them in. Also sometimes dogs need a little more time to mature than two years and their hips can pass if they are a little bit older. But a for-profit operation that doesn't even wait until the dog is two to breed? Forget about hip clearances.

But I don't think it's her dog she is talking about...as she has no hip clearances on any of them! If you look at who her females are from...my guess is that is where she heard the story to justify breeding with no clearances.

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If I'm not mistaken, OFA won't re-evaluate hips or elbows. Once you fail, you fail. So right off the bat, I'm not sure she is being honest.
Incorrect. You can re-submit for evaluation and a possibly better rating.
 

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They will...very often positioning can mean the difference between a fair and a good...or a single hip being rated as grade 1 while the other hip is fine. It is common to wait three months for a new panel. Then do a new set of xrays and send them in. Also sometimes dogs need a little more time to mature than two years and their hips can pass if they are a little bit older. But a for-profit operation that doesn't even wait until the dog is two to breed? Forget about hip clearances.

But I don't think it's her dog she is talking about...as she has no hip clearances on any of them! If you look at who her females are from...my guess is that is where she heard the story to justify breeding with no clearances.

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Incorrect. You can re-submit for evaluation and a possibly better rating.

Thanks for the clarification! :smile2:
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Hi. OP. here. Also wanted to mention she said since she lives in Vermont, there are NO good or qualified OFA vets in our area....We're 1.5 hrs from Albany NY. She did say both parents had their " prelims" on hips and passed. Don't know what this is. She also went on to tell me she's never had any issues as far back as 6 generations.
 

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Hi. OP. here. Also wanted to mention she said since she lives in Vermont, there are NO good or qualified OFA vets in our area....We're 1.5 hrs from Albany NY. She did say both parents had their " prelims" on hips and passed. Don't know what this is. She also went on to tell me she's never had any issues as far back as 6 generations.
Did she also say she had a bridge for sale? >:)

Any vet with X-ray capability can submit hip and elbow x-rays. Considering x-ray is a common diagnostic tool for all kinds of veterinary issues, I call BS on that. And that whole never had issues, how do you know if you are not checking? Dysplasia, especially mild cases don’t necessarily cause lameness and sometimes not untill older when people might blame it on old age.
 

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Hi. OP. here. Also wanted to mention she said since she lives in Vermont, there are NO good or qualified OFA vets in our area....We're 1.5 hrs from Albany NY. She did say both parents had their " prelims" on hips and passed. Don't know what this is. She also went on to tell me she's never had any issues as far back as 6 generations.
Prelims (x-rays) are done before a dog turns 2. They are used sometimes by show people who want to determine if they should pursue a Championship on a young dog. Or possibly because a responsible breeder wants to repeat a breeding before the first litter is two, so a few from the 1st litter get prelims. They are also used by backyard breeders to justify breeding a dog earlier than 2, which is the age when you can get a hip certification from the OFA.

No problems? I would consider Apple's Grandfather failing OFAs a problem.
 

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Butternut Hill Golden's is in North Central Vermont and doesn't appear to have issues getting their dogs certifications done properly. It is a breeder I looked at September '17 but only sells to people in New England (I thought odd). Oceans Breeze is a for profit breeder and is just trying to skirt around doing clearances because they know their dogs are off low quality breedings.

Lol don't believe in OFA hip clearances... This breeder needs to be blacklisted.
 

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26 weeks ago this breeder surfaced on a golden retriever litter listing page (one that requires the minimum clearances in order for litters to be listed) seeking a girl for her son and of course was looking for full registration. At the time she had a couple of litters in the works or on the ground--but none would supposedly produce the dock diver she wanted. It was pointed out back then about the lacking of clearances and lack of mentorship available. She said she was working w/ a better breeder & was getting clearances...26 weeks ago. This is someone who knows better & chooses not to do better in hopes that her stories will convince you that she is above board...sadly it seems to be a shtick that is working.
 

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Hi. OP. here. Also wanted to mention she said since she lives in Vermont, there are NO good or qualified OFA vets in our area....We're 1.5 hrs from Albany NY. She did say both parents had their " prelims" on hips and passed. Don't know what this is. She also went on to tell me she's never had any issues as far back as 6 generations.

Facts To Ponder :

Any vet can take and submit xrays to OFA. There is no certification.

There are 126 dogs in a puppy's six generation pedigree. I assure you, she doesn't even know the NAME of all 126 dogs in her pups' pedigrees, much less their hip status.

Don't fall for any of her baloney. Don't give her your hard earned money.
 

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Randomness regarding the 1.5 hours from Albany, NY....

Gather the implication is you are saying the breeder is too far away to make the trip out to get OFA's - assuming she doesn't like the local vets for some reason?

When my puppy is old enough (in about 1.5 years), I'm planning on driving the hour south to a specific veterinarian to get the OFA's done. 2nd choice vet is about 45 minutes away.

Other people within the state are driving 2-3 hours to bring their dogs to my first choice vet. Heck, I've heard she gets some people driving about 7 hours to bring their dogs in from out of state.

If most of dog show people are driving 2+ hours to go to dog shows. And other people I know drive 2+ hours to do fun matches and other training activities with their dogs. They don't begrudge driving the same distance to get to a good vet they can trust to get OFA's done.
 

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Hi. OP. here. Also wanted to mention she said since she lives in Vermont, there are NO good or qualified OFA vets in our area....We're 1.5 hrs from Albany NY. She did say both parents had their " prelims" on hips and passed. Don't know what this is. She also went on to tell me she's never had any issues as far back as 6 generations.
When I started looking for a new puppy several months ago, I fortunately found this forum and learned a lot about what I should look for to find a quality breeder. Living in So Cal there were many options that could help us find a great puppy.

The one thing that strikes me, however, is that many of the breeders out there who are not following the GRCA rules are charging as much or more than the reputable breeders who are working hard to better the breed. The reason the less ethical or knowledgeable breeders charge this much is because there are still plenty of people who decide on a whim to get a puppy, do a quick google search to find a local breeder, and make their decision based on how cute the puppies look without knowing anything else.
 

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Pedigree: Oceans Breeze Little Trickster Loki and all the sibs- this pedigree just kills me. It is 5 generations of (on the top half) a perfect example of trust being given where it was not deserved. The bottom half is just a wreck. On another thread someone asked about how the breed is hurt by using stud dog on bitch both owned by same and on all the girls there- this pedigree is an example of how that damage happens.
 

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We have had a Golden from them for 4years he is the best dog I have ever had. I get nothing but compliments from Vets and trainers on how well breed this dog is. I have had his hips and elbows OFA’d and both came back good. He has competed in Agility and Barn Hunt. We also Dockdive with him. I am on the list for a puppy from their next litter. I have noticed they are doing OFA’s along with heart and eyes. They even test for CNL. They do deworming at 2,4,6,& 8 weeks, they also vaccinat and microchip all puppies. They are the only breeders I know that have their puppies examed at 6 weeks and then at 8 weeks by their vet . They are not backyard breeders or puppymill. These dogs are taken care of and very much loved. They are now working with a breeder that is helping them with their questions. I would recommend these women to anyone who would love a wonderful Golden retriever. Also one of you said they are in it for the money. With the bag full of dog toys, collar and leash and other dog goodies they send you home with money is not an issue and they donate 2 puppies a year to organizations that train service dogs.
 
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