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Old 01-06-2013, 01:11 AM
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Murmur discovered at 3 day checkup on 7 week old

My 7 week old puppy which we've had for 3 days was diagnosed today by our vet with a grade 2 heart murmur. The puppy comes from an impressive championship "show" background and has all appropriate clearances dating back several generations. We are pretty confident in the breeder and have done lots of research on the forum about heart murmurs and how a grade 2 can potentially go away with time.

My concern: This puppy was the last puppy left of a large litter with many of the puppies going to "show" and a few going to companion homes which my puppy falls into the companion category. My breeder has records of his Vet giving first round of vaccinations just 6 days earlier. Is it possible the breeder's Vet missed the heart murmur. My thoughts are if the puppy has a grade 2 murmur today, he must have had it 6 days ago. Either the breeder's Vet missed the murmur or he actually diagnosed the murmur and my breeder withheld this information.

I'm just looking for some help from the forum to level set me on all this. We have fallen in love with our puppy but also paid a significant amount of money to find a puppy with the highest probability for health and longevity so this news concerns us greatly. Since it was discovered within the 3 day window we are unsure what to do and looking for help. (I do understand mother nature has the ultimate say but health history is important).

The breeder says this is very normal in puppies and we will be completely fine and to check with the Vet in a couple weeks to see if the murmur is still there. Am I over-reacting?

Thanks for everyone's feedback/help!
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:06 AM
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I have a copy of the results of the Puppy Wellness Examination that was done at 7 weeks by the breeder.

It states "no murmers."

Is it possible for you to get a copy of it? I would ask.
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:23 AM
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It sounds like you have taken the most important step and notified your breeder. Yes, heart murmurs have been know to go away as a puppy ages. Not an expert on this by any stretch, so maybe the others will weigh in. Is your vet a cardiologist? My thought is that it is really difficult for a practitioner to accurately put a rating to the murmur.?
Will the breeder still take the puppy back or refund (which ever you prefer or the contract states) if the puppy does not grow out of the murmur?
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Old 01-06-2013, 06:00 AM
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I have a papillon of six years old now, who I paid a lot of money for at 16 weeks old, & discovered he had a double heart murmur a few days later. The vet told me he would probably grow out of it, & said it would not cause problems. He still has one heart murmur now, but it has never affected his health up to this point. I would be worried that the breeder might have the baby euthanised if you return it to her. The breeder of my little papillon did not tell me he had murmurs, but she must have known.
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Old 01-06-2013, 06:42 AM
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With a grade 2, I wouldn't be too concerned. I'd get it checked at the next visit in 3-4 weeks and if it is still there then I would consider a cardiologist visit.
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Old 01-06-2013, 07:33 AM
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Aside from saying that the dog will outgrow it, did the breeder say anything about taking the dog back?
One thing I am really curious about, why did the breeder give the pups away so early?
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:06 AM
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Heart murmurs that are that low of a grade more than likely will go away. Her vet may not have heard it as it may not have either been there or was even quieter. Some heart murmurs are transient, so they aren't there all the time. So for now, take a deep breath, see what happens in the next visit or 2. If its still present by the last visit or has gotten worse then get it checked out further. Dont make any rash decisions when this could be nothing at all.
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:16 AM
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I might be a good idea to do a "what if" scenario with the breeder so that you are prepared for most things and know where you and she stand.
What if the heart murmur isn't gone by the next visit?
What if the puppy needs an echo?
What if it is more serious?
What costs will the breeder take responsibility for?
What costs will you be responsible for?
Will the breeder require you to return the pup to get a refund if it turns out to be a serious murmur?

I had a similar situation and the answers to those question from a very responsible breeder were:
If the murmur didn't go away, and the pup needed an echo, the breeder would pay for it.
If it turned out to be a serious problem, the breeder would return the purchase price of the pup and it would be my choice as to whether to keep the pup or return it to the breeder.
The murmur disappeared by the next vet visit so none of this was necessary but it was nice to know the "what if's" going into this.
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Old 01-06-2013, 01:34 PM
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Our breeder would not clear any of her puppies until they were seen by both an ophthalmologist and cardiologist. It cost her $$$ to do this but we paid a hefty price for Nugget (even as a companion). Hopefully your breeder will pay for a cardio consult before any further steps are taken.

By the way, we did have a golden years ago that did have some serious heart issues. He was backyard bred and there were no guarantees whatsoever. That being said he lived to be 13 and died of cancer rather than his heart.
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