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Old 11-26-2012, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricksmith View Post
Thanks for the info. Few questions:

1. What advantage does the clicker have over simply praising the dog, saying "Good dog!" and giving him a treat when he does the behavior correctly?

2. If you use the clicker how do you correct bad behavior? How does the dog know that 'No" means no?
The way our trainer taught it, the click can pin point the exact behavior your training. For instance, when we're training Bear to touch our outstretched hand with his nose (versus his teeth or worse - jumping on us), w/o the clicker Bear wouldn't be able to figure out if his treat came for standing, for sitting, for smelling, for licking, for looking at us, for touching us with his nose, etc. With the clicker, as soon as his nose touched my hand, Click!

My trainer is 100% against the word "no". I'm 50% in aggrement with her. However, Bear knows "no" means don't do that. He's been taught "no bite" (though sometimes I can't get through his land shark feeding frenzy). When I tell Bear "no", I immediately follow it with a command so I can praise his good behavior.

The trainer see clicker training as a way to classically condition the dog. action = treat. Since the dog is extremely intelligent, with enough training (and often refresher courses) the dog will create a list of rewarding behavior - sitting, lying down, being calm, walking nicely, etc - and a list of non-rewarding behaviors (barking, jumping, biting, etc). If list A = treat and list B = nothing; the dog will begin choosing to give you actions from list A.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:13 PM
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I like the concept, but not the clicker.

We just go straight to using the "yes" word instead of bothering with a clicker.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricksmith View Post
Thanks for the info. Few questions:

1. What advantage does the clicker have over simply praising the dog, saying "Good dog!" and giving him a treat when he does the behavior correctly?

The clicker is quicker, once you get the timing down, the idea is to 'click' the behavior the instant it happens, then offer the reward. For example: when you are teaching your pup to sit - you want to 'click' the instant his bum hits the floor. Praise takes a 'long' time compared to the click or marker word (I use Yes), so your pup may have sat, but by the time the praise comes he may be standing, or sniffing the floor so it is not clear to him what he did to earn the praise.

2. If you use the clicker how do you correct bad behavior? How does the dog know that 'No" means no?
If 'bad' behavior during training sessions means not giving the response you want, you don't click. If you have 'powered up' your clicker, meaning the dog fully understands what the click means, when he doesn't get a click for the behavior his is performing, then he knows it is wrong, and can try again. You can also train a 'no reward' marker - I use 'try again', when the behavior offered is not the one I want.

I don't use 'no' - 'No' gives no information, it does not tell or show the dog what you want him TO do.
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:07 PM
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Although there are some things I use a clicker for, clicker training is one of my least favorite methods of training. It is a very sterile, scientific method meant to minimize the role of the person. I LIKE being a part of the training, having my hands on my dog during the process. The main reason I train my dog is for the bonding, and I don't feel the same bonding in clicker training.

Not to mention my youngest gets very frustrated if he can't figure out what I want him to quickly enough. He never gives up, but doesn't enjoy it like he does our other training. He'd much rather me just show him what to do than make him figure it out
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:16 PM
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The clicker is positive only and I LOVE it. I swear Yukon, my dog, speaks "clicker" He's is a genius with it!
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:24 PM
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The clicker is faster than saying the word, "yes". Since golden #3, all have been clicker trained in this household... However, I do use negative words, etc..
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loisiana View Post
Although there are some things I use a clicker for, clicker training is one of my least favorite methods of training. It is a very sterile, scientific method meant to minimize the role of the person. I LIKE being a part of the training, having my hands on my dog during the process. The main reason I train my dog is for the bonding, and I don't feel the same bonding in clicker training.

Not to mention my youngest gets very frustrated if he can't figure out what I want him to quickly enough. He never gives up, but doesn't enjoy it like he does our other training. He'd much rather me just show him what to do than make him figure it out
I do think you can do both.. the clicker is just a marker. How you train your dog to get to do what you want is up to you. Depending on what I am trying to teach I can be very hands on with Molly and the clicker helps her get it very quickly. It is just a way for me to mark what I want because my timing is not good when I say "yes".
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vhuynh2 View Post
I do think you can do both.. the clicker is just a marker. How you train your dog to get to do what you want is up to you. Depending on what I am trying to teach I can be very hands on with Molly and the clicker helps her get it very quickly. It is just a way for me to mark what I want because my timing is not good when I say "yes".
Yeah but that's not technically considered "clicker training". That's training using a clicker. Sounds similar but a huge difference. You would never touch your dog in clicker training.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:17 PM
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A friend is getting a Lab from a breeder near Memphis. His wife was showing me the video on an 8 week training class they offer for the pups. One of the trainers has his clicker attached by a short string to the bottom of the treat bag - the motion was very smooth, click and move up to get the treat all the same motion. I plan to try that.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loisiana View Post
Yeah but that's not technically considered "clicker training". That's training using a clicker. Sounds similar but a huge difference. You would never touch your dog in clicker training.
Sorry, I only glanced at the first part of the your previous post and thought I had read you did not like clickers at all.

I like using the clicker as a marker, it really helps Molly learn new concepts faster. But I do need to put my hands on her sometimes.. and I do use a negative sound.
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