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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 01:23 PM Thread Starter
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ok...so I do apologize if I offended anyone, but Canis understands my point. The world of breeders has become more like a competition. It seems as though everyone I talk to or read about has the right answers; regardless of what someone else says. It has become quite frustrating...the term "bandwagon" seems to be fitting, yet no one knows who is driving the "bandwagon" or where it is going, and there seems to be a quite a bit of arrogance from those on the wagon.
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by McDog View Post
ok...so I do apologize if I offended anyone, but Canis understands my point. The world of breeders has become more like a competition. It seems as though everyone I talk to or read about has the right answers; regardless of what someone else says. It has become quite frustrating...the term "bandwagon" seems to be fitting, yet no one knows who is driving the "bandwagon" or where it is going, and there seems to be a quite a bit of arrogance from those on the wagon.
I think you should get the dog you want. I also think you should try to be a bit nicer to ppl on this forum. I'm not a breeder, nor on any "bandwagon" but I was offended.
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by McDog View Post
ok...so I do apologize if I offended anyone, but Canis understands my point. The world of breeders has become more like a competition. It seems as though everyone I talk to or read about has the right answers; regardless of what someone else says. It has become quite frustrating...the term "bandwagon" seems to be fitting, yet no one knows who is driving the "bandwagon" or where it is going, and there seems to be a quite a bit of arrogance from those on the wagon.
If you want to get a dog out of a sire and dam with hip clearances and nothing else, that is ok...go for it! But on the flip side, do not go asking if it sounds ok and when you get someone asking about other clearances start saying people are arrogant and on a bandwagon. You can't have it both ways.

There are many ways to breed dogs, I choose to do it my way (so of course, I deem it the best way. Please note, I did NOT state it's the only way, nor the way everyone should do it.), if one seeks opinions I will suggest looking for breeders that do things much the same as I do, which would not be one that does hips only (just as an example).

If one wishes to make blanket statements that no one really knows what they are talking about nor why they are talking the way they do, that's fine too. In my opinion the only person missing out is the one who chooses to not take the advice from all sides and make up their own minds.

Again, good luck with your puppy.

Rob

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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Canis Lupus Nubilus View Post
All valid questions indeed. However, the OP's tone may have seemed offensive. Previously I have seen many replies regarding this same topic that are very condescending in nature. Especially when some people "settle" on a breeder who doesn't meet the standards of the majority. Then the bandwagon gets flooded with negative posts and people don't get answers.
Personally, I have a Chocolate Lab and it's only guaranteed to an extent. She's fully registered and perhaps one of the best dock diving competitors in the state, obeys complex commands, and is fantastic with people/children. And has a very clean bill of health. For only $200.00

What I'm saying, is that I believe the breeding business has pulled the wool over many eyes
in creating this complex that your dog has to be genetically "appropriate" in order to be acceptable. Unfortunately, it is necessary to do this due to lack of responsibilities in previous breeding strains.
All in all, there's been a commonality amongst breeding forums that mirrors elitism that unwelcomes concerned folks as the OP of this thread.
Although, rude. His point is valid. Prolly should've been titled something else though.
I'll bite. What was his point in his original post?

As for the comments on previous breeding strains etc. I do not believe that is it at all. As science advances so does our health screening. Elbows were not really thought of 20-30 years ago, advancements are made thus allowing us to see trends, screening procedures start. There is no 'strain' to blame, in my opinion.

Clearances are tools, they are to help stack the odds in favour of the conditions being tested for not presenting in progeny. In this breed we have what are called the core four, Hips, Elbows, Heart and Eyes. We then have non-core clearances, prcd-PRA, PRA1, PRA2, Ict., DM, etc. I am of the mind set of, if we do not test we do not know what we are working with. That is what works for my breeding program, others it doesn't, that is a-ok. What clearances are not, are a means to jack up puppy prices, nor are they elitist.

Rob

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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 02:26 PM
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McDog, you just joined this forum and are 6 posts in. You didn't get very far before name calling and offending people. There is no bandwagon. There is, however, a great wealth of knowledge on this forum about necessary clearances and hereditary issues in the breed. Rather than passing judgment on people and assuming things, I suggest you give the forum members a chance to help you and you will benefit from their knowledge.

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post #16 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McDog View Post
With just a little research I found a decent breeder! I tried to make it too hard, but I did find a breeder that does what I want and need...check it out!

  • Vet checked three times before adoption.
  • Both parents are OFA cleared for hips.
  • All shots and worming.
  • Written one year health guarantee.
  • Raised indoors from birth to adoption.
  • Starter kit with food, toys, etc...
  • Not adopted until after 8 weeks.
I just felt like these were the basic necessities for what my particular needs are as a CD owner.
Is a need of yours, as a CD owner, a walk around the block? Because with only hip clearances, that might be an issue should your puppy develop ED, like my Golden. Chance can't walk very far at all without stopping several times. And if we do go a little too far, (which, for a healthy dog, would be just warming up), he pays for it dearly the next day. Are you ready for blood work every 3 months to make sure your dog's liver is functioning properly? I have to have this done because the medication he takes for his dysplasia can, unfortunately, really screw his liver up.

Every time a thread comes up about what the "basic necessities" needed for a breeder to be responsible are, we just want to put the information out there for those that are still searching and hopefully they're willing to accept it. I always bring up elbow clearances because I want to try and spare those people the heartache that I live with every day. If input like this seems arrogant, no one here meant that at all. Passionate and caring, yeah...but not arrogant.

Karen, Chance, Lucy and Savanah (RB)

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post #17 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 03:51 PM
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I made the mistake of getting a BYB dog. It's a risk that I took, because I didn't know. Now that I know more about clearances, what is behind some of the Golden pedigrees, and health issues in those lines; I have made a relationship with a breeder in my area that is above and beyond what I expected.

You came on here saying what you found, but, we thought you could do better for the health of your puppy. Since I took that risk of getting a back-yard bred dog, I have to live with it daily, knowing at any moment cancer could come at an early age, etc.

We are only trying to help you out here, and not go through the heartbreak that some of our forum members have gone through; like losing a puppy at 3 because of cancer. Finding a good breeder can be rocket science, as some are more about winning in the ring, and others are striving for health and longevity.

I would rather have clearances that go generations back, than a puppy who drops dead at 3 years of age, due to an early onset of cancer.

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post #18 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 03:53 PM
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At 9:30 this morning you asked for opinions on a breeder to which many responded that you keep looking. Not two hours later you have found the *perfect* breeder and that it "ain't rocket science!" It is hard not to take some offense as you insinuate that we are all idiots, we, people who went out of our way to give our honest opinion in an effort to help a total stranger find a healthy, sound family dog, in the best interest of the breed. We need to continue to support breeders that have this breeds best interest at heart.

I agree with many of the posters here. Please consider investigating further. Insist on all 4 clearances. Don't short change your future pet of a long, healthy future it deserves.
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post #19 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McDog View Post
With just a little research I found a decent breeder! I tried to make it too hard, but I did find a breeder that does what I want and need...check it out!

  • Vet checked three times before adoption.
  • Both parents are OFA cleared for hips.
  • All shots and worming.
  • Written one year health guarantee.
  • Raised indoors from birth to adoption.
  • Starter kit with food, toys, etc...
  • Not adopted until after 8 weeks.
I just felt like these were the basic necessities for what my particular needs are as a CD owner. The breeder was well spoken, and welcomed any and all of my questions. Her photos and description of the parents were spot on for what I am looking for in a golden,and she had no arrogance in her demeanor regarding her dogs. I think I may have found my breeder. Is there anything else that anyone could recommend?

If you didn't want suggestions than you should had deleted your last sentence. If you are happy with the breeder you found then go for it!

On a side note: cancer is not discriminatory. It affects all dogs from all breeders. Nothing is guaranteed.

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post #20 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 04:46 PM
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I think you are all getting played here.

50 year olds don't say, "dayum."

New member named, McDog? C'mon.....


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